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Making room for God in a changing world

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Posted: Saturday, January 5, 2013 7:00 pm

Change is not always good. That should be obvious to anyone who has observed Congress for more than a minute, but unfortunately there seems to be a built-in human bias which assumes that we collectively get wiser as time passes.

This optimism bubbles up despite mankind being the race which up till now has given us the charming innovations of slavery, car bombs, and, of course, flying passenger airplanes into occupied skyscrapers. Not to mention — in the last century alone — two world wars, the Holocaust, the killing fields of Cambodia, and the nuclear bomb.

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          Welcome to the discussion.

          246 comments:

          • It's a beautiful day posted at 6:13 pm on Sat, Jan 12, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            kohana, Let's have a little unbiased political criticism. Having formerly worked for the US Census bureau in 2000, I noticed that there is no separate category for the Jewish race. You are either a White Caucasian or White Non-Hispanic. The vast majority of Non-Hispanic Whites trace their origins to Europe. A small number have origin in North Africa or the Middle East. Most American's of Jewish decent view the Zionist state of Israel as purely racially motivated segregation and racial profiling that leads to discrimination, bigotry, and a rebirth of neo-conservative hatred which will lead us into WWIII. Should we not strive for an Egalitarian society in the 21st century? This is really what liberty or true libertarianism is all about.

             
          • kohana posted at 3:35 pm on Sat, Jan 12, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            Sad rebuttal Rob, you don’t need to agree with me but calling it something it isn’t doesn’t do the job. "But if you expect me to somehow accept a G.W.Bush style "You're either with us or against us!" moronic political nincompoopiness, you are mistaken."

            I don’t expect you to accept anything political. You are the one expecting me to heave to the far left and condemn me as Bush style RINO. I have never been much for politics, haven’t been much interested, and always felt the politicians are just in it for their own self-aggrandizement. I firmly believe there has been no politician since JFK, and maybe not even him, who made any decisions for the betterment of this country. I also firmly believed at least, they wouldn’t turn this country into a communist/socialist or a totalitarian dictatorship either.

            “As for history and the West Bank, heck, we gave Okinawa back in 1972 or so. A sign of good will....”

            You’re smarter than that Rob. We helped rebuild Germany as well as helped rebuild Japan. Germany twice as a matter of fact, after WWI as well. Okinawa is about 7,600 miles from Washington D.C. and wasn’t firing missiles trying to wipe it off the face of the earth. Strange we never let Cuba off the hook as a sign of good will. And why not? Afraid of a communist missile base maybe? But are you forgetting that Israel gave back all of the Sinai, and turned over Gaza as a sign of good will and how’d that work out? And actually the West Bank is under PA control since the 1993 Oslo Accords, so how is that working out for them?

            I would suggest you listen to Pat Condell's opinion of the Guardian.
            The ugliest newspaper in Britain.

            http://dotsub.com/view/cb4941af-6c14-4d85-a292-3601e2478814

             
          • Rob123 posted at 3:23 pm on Sat, Jan 12, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            HTC: "BIG difference but perhaps not so gargantuan as to finally show up on your '60s era personal radar?"

            I think you're the one stuck in the 1960's with notions of big Tank Attacks in the age of Rockets and Gun Ships.......Very NeoConish of you.

            http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/nov/05/west-bank-barrier-starved-business-communities

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 3:00 pm on Sat, Jan 12, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Rob123: As for history and the West Bank, heck, we gave Okinawa back in 1972 or so. A sign of good will......

            HTC: Yes, but the Japanese surrendered and stopped waging war against us. Last I looked, Israel's enemies are still bent on her distruction.

            BIG difference but perhaps not so gargantuan as to finally show up on your '60s era personal radar?

            The West Bank is a far better spot from which to launch missile-based or artillery-based attacks on Israel. That's THE primary reason why they can never afford to give it back.

             
          • Rob123 posted at 2:01 pm on Sat, Jan 12, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            kohana posted at 11:00 am on Sat, Jan 12, 2013.

            I don't agree with you......However, I am not anti-Jew or anti-Israel. I am, however, anti-Right Wing no matter the Religion or Ideology. Feel free to go back through my posts and prove me wrong. But if you expect me to somehow accept a G.W.Bush style "You're either with us or against us!" moronic political nincompoopiness, you are mistaken. And to up his rhetoric to "Bring it on!" killed a lot of people over 10 years plus $1 Trillion and counting.

            As for history and the West Bank, heck, we gave Okinawa back in 1972 or so. A sign of good will......and there are still Militant Japanese with much anti-American feelings. However, instances of outrage by such Right Wing groups in Japan don't get turned into giant Geo-Political front page baloney. There are seen for what they are.

             
          • kohana posted at 2:00 pm on Sat, Jan 12, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            Jan. 12, 2013 2:17pm

            Tiffany Gabbay

            Last week, TheBlaze published a series of articles detailing the sale of Al Gore’s Current TV to the Qatar-based Al Jazeera network. Established was also the fact that Gore and company made a point of claiming that the reasons for choosing to sell to Al Jazeera stemmed from their aligned ideologies. Since Al Jazeera was first to provide a forum to Osama bin Laden immediately following the 9/11 attacks, has consistently propogated blood libel and hosts a rabidly anti-Semitic, anti-Western Islamic televangelist as its star-talent, the idea of such “shared goals and visions” is unsettling to say the least.

            Which brings us to what really compelled Gore and his partners at Current TV to sell their network to Al Jazeera. Money.

            Indeed, it is not so far fetched to think that perhaps Current executives were simply acting in the name of capitalism. After all, it would be difficult for Gore to turn down $100 million of the $500 million total offer Al Jazeera placed on the table. Not to mention, while we don’t have access to all of the offers the network received, it stands to reason al Jazeera’s was likely the highest offer Current had received.

            Now if Current executives had been forthright in their motivations for selling to Al Jazeera, while some would still not have liked their choice, it would have gone a long way in fostering at least a modicum of respect for the sheer honesty alone. What most critics are likely upset about is the hypocrisy involved — and that hypocrisy spans an extensive gamut including but not limited to:

            · An “environmentalist-pioneer” (Al Gore) selling out to a network funded by Middle East big oil.
            · A proudly liberal Current claiming it shares core values with a network that consistently perpetuates anti-Semitism, anti-Western sentiment and whose “talent” openly supports the whipping if not outright execution of gays and lesbians, the subjugation of women, and a host of other ills anathema to human rights and true progressivism.
            · A man who, some might claim favors the “fair share” meme, trying with all his might to push through the Al Jazeera deal prior to January 2013 in order to avoid the increased capital gains taxes that would be incurred following the enactment of the Fiscal Cliff bill. He failed in his efforts, however, making Gore, in the words of Blaze finance writer Becket Adams, “the world’s lousiest tax-dodger.”

            But are Al Gore and his cohorts the only ones playing both sides against the middle here? Fox News, while its anchors and pundits have been astute in pointing out the intellectual and ethical inconsistencies of Current TV executives, seem to be missing one fairly glaring example of hypocrisy right in their own backyard: Namely that Fox head Rupert Murdoch owns nearly 20 percent of Rotana Media, the Arab world’s largest entertainment company and parent of the Kuwait-based network al Risala.

            What’s more, al Risala, which is Arabic for “The Islamic Message,” is owned by Saudi prince Talal bin Alwaleed, who also happens to own a 7 percent share of Murdoch’s News Corp., making him the largest single shareholder after the Murdoch family. This in itself might not raise eyebrows if it were not for the type of content al Risala dissemniates on a regular basis, which is an amalgamation of anti-Semitic blood libel, Islamist-supremacy, anti-Western sentiment and Muslim Brotherhood propaganda.

            Dr. Andrew Bostom, scholar and author of “Sharia versus Freedom” and author Diana West have provided a wealth of information showcasing the type of Muslim Brotherhood-driven content offered on al Risala as well as greater details on Murdoch’s stake in the media outlet. But other than a precious few who have sat up and taken notice, who else will speak out when the double-standard no longer fits the narrative they’d hope to spin?

            It might not have been popular for West or Bostom to call Murdoch’s bluff — after all, Fox Network has typically been a powerful champion against the very ideals al Jazeera and al Risala embody — but they believe that integrity matters. What is good for the goose is just as good for the gander.

            On the satirical front, Daily Show host Jon Stewart took a jab at Fox in a segment that duly noted the double-standard at play when the network’s talking heads condemned Al Gore. The issue, however, is that while correct in his assessment of Fox, Stewart simultaneously downplayed al Jazeera’s true nature by characterizing it as simply a “Muslim” network disseminating a Muslim – not an Islamist — point of view. That, of course, is disingenuous, unless he seeks to imply that everyday Muslims share the same worldview as imam Yussuf al-Qawadari.

            Now one might posit that since Murdoch never vocalized sharing the same goals and values of the various networks he helps to fund, he is somehow exculpated from wrongdoing. It can also be argued that since al Risala is not (yet) catering to an American audience, the Australian media mogul has managed to keep above the fray, or at least, beneath the radar when it comes to hypocrisy. At the end of the day, so long as money rules the day and people continue to invest in businesses with blood on their hands, capitalism will continue to be given a bad name. It doesn’t matter which side of the political fence the investors fall on, they will be judged, and rightly so, based on the company they keep.

            Sunlight is always the best disinfectant.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 11:07 am on Sat, Jan 12, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            IABD- Making way for GAWD it stinks in this room. Fortunately for the world, Microsoft has developed a new solution for a changing world. Whoda thunk it? Just imagine someone finally inventing a new version of an outhouse with Windows that even Works. :)

            Caltech toilet is No. 1 in Gates Foundation contest
            The Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation announced the winner of a contest to solve the problem of sanitation — toilets! — in the developing world. A team from the California Institute of Technology took first place in the foundation's "Reinvent the Toilet Challenge."

            By Theodoric Meyer
            Seattle Times staff reporter

            ALAN BERNER / THE SEATTLE TIMES

            Caltech professor Michael Hoffmann explains how the team's solar-powered toilet works. The Caltech team came in first in the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation's challenge, winning $100,000 for its design.

            The Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation on Tuesday unveiled the winner of a contest to design a replacement for a technology that hasn't changed much since the 19th century: the flush toilet.

            The new toilets are designed primarily for the developing world, where the lack of plumbing often makes conventional toilets impractical. The winning loo, a solar-powered model designed by researchers from the California Institute of Technology, or Caltech, generates hydrogen and electricity to boot.

            Toilets, foundation co-chair Bill Gates said in his opening remarks, are "kind of an ignored area" of efforts to help the world's poor, but a crucially important one. Roughly 2.6 billion people in the world lack access to toilets, and 1.5 million children die annually from diarrheal diseases.

            Policymakers have tended to shy away from the problem until now, said Crown Prince Willem-Alexander of the Netherlands, who works with the United Nations on this sanitation issue. "Toilets are simply not sexy," he said.

            The winning design looks like a regular toilet, at least above ground. After use, the waste is flushed down to a holding tank under the floor, where the solid material sinks to the bottom. When the liquid reaches a certain level, it flows through a tube into a "sun-powered electrochemical reactor." The reaction oxidizes the chloride in the urine, killing microorganisms in it.

            The treated water is filtered and reused the next time someone sits on the toilet. And the residual chlorine in the water means, "The next flush would already have disinfectant in it," said Michael Hoffmann, the professor at Caltech who led the team that designed the toilet.

            The hydrogen, meanwhile, could be siphoned off, and the toilet's owners could "use it as you would use gaseous propane" for cooking, he said. The whole thing is powered with solar energy.

            The technology behind the toilet isn't new, Hoffmann said. He had developed a version of the electrochemical treatment process, for instance, for NASA years earlier. But the Gates Foundation's challenge to eight universities a year ago — along with a $400,000 grant to each — allowed the pieces to come together.

            Hoffman and the Caltech team won a $100,000 prize. The second-place team, from the University of Loughborough in the United Kingdom, won $60,000 for its design, which would convert feces into a type of charcoal. A team from the University of Toronto won third place and $40,000 for a toilet that treats solid waste through dehydration and low-temperature combustion. A Swiss team was singled out for special recognition and won $40,000 as well.

            Hoffmann's toilet, which could cost $1,000 or more per unit, is still in the early stages of development, and it is unlikely to proceed to market without changes.

            Gates said he hopes that once a next-generation toilet is fully designed, it will incorporate ideas from a variety of toilet designs submitted in the contest: "We think the combination of a lot of this work is what will get us to the eventual solution."

             
          • kohana posted at 11:00 am on Sat, Jan 12, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            Rob123 posted at 3:00 am on Sat, Jan 12, 2013

            I was responding to a post that the person seemed to KNOW what a progressive gGod was/did/preferred/etc. to what a conservative gGod was/did/preferred, etc. How this person could KNOW that is beyond me. He was expressing an opinion, but didn’t state it as an opinion but as a fact.

            Now you calling me one of the “chosen” as a derogatory expression is attacking me personally, and not a critic of any opinion. I posted several days ago an article from the Jewish Virtual Library that explains how the expression is used. It is not for any one person but for a nation of people to bring the “idea” of a “righteous and just” gGod to the world, which they have done. They also don’t get any special reward or privileges for doing so; notice the hell, as a people, they have suffered for millennias for their ideas. And are still suffering because they are who they are.

            Israel has every right to the West Bank. The Arabs attacked Israel, Israel won, and kept the won territory. Maybe you didn't read the history I have given you, and on this blog over and over again. But, it is okay for USA to steal land and territory from the American Indians, and from the Spanish, (CA, TX) and call it a war but not give the land back; but not for the Israelis who are defending themselves. However, you want the "chosen" (preferably an expletive here) Israelis to give it back.

            I have no argument with someone criticizing my opinions or ideas, but you are not doing that. You are criticizing me personally and attributing a political philosophy to me of which I have no part. I personally couldn’t stand Reagan when he was Gov. of CA, and couldn’t stand him as president. But you don’t know that as you have never asked, or don’t remember what I have written about him in the past.

            Our Republic as a country is in dire trouble with the current administration and you seem not to think so. However, I post articles from people who are as concerned as I am, who have more facts than I do, and your response to these posts is to attack me. You might just say, “I disagree with that post” and leave it.

             
          • Rob123 posted at 9:50 am on Sat, Jan 12, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            HighTechCowboy posted at 4:59 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.
            That was just plumb stupid.....
            HighTechCowboy posted at 6:24 am on Sat, Jan 12, 2013.
            Your responses when you've got nothing are SO predictable.

            How would you like me to respond to 'nothing'? Watch 'Dooms Day Preppers' on the National Geographic Channel with you? Of course, I would probably try to lead you out of your bunker and introduce you to Zen, as a start. http://www.mountainsoftravelphotos.com/Tibet%20-%20Buddhism/Buddhist%20Comics/slides/01%20Bizarro%20-%20Zen%20Crossword%20Puzzle.html
            Of course, it's not what you think...............................................

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 6:27 am on Sat, Jan 12, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Rob123 posted at 3:00 am on Sat, Jan 12, 2013

            kohana has demonstrated that she still learns from experience and critical analysis of the world around her.

            You? Not so much.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 6:24 am on Sat, Jan 12, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Rob123: That was just plumb stupid.....

            HTC: Your responses when you've got nothing are SO predictable.

             
          • Rob123 posted at 4:18 am on Sat, Jan 12, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            HighTechCowboy posted at 4:59 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            That was just plumb stupid.....

             
          • Rob123 posted at 3:00 am on Sat, Jan 12, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            kohana posted at 8:29 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.
            Posts: 1374
            "I love the 1st amendment, even the very ignorant of all biblical scholarship, can post their drivel."

            Well said! Your choice of words puts you firmly into the camp of a retired D 8 Cat Skinner who cleared land on the Biblical West Bank for the Chosen People to move in and take over. Oh sure, in reality you're a Retired California government Civil Servant, but hey! It's Montucky , and you've moved to the Right and are now freely expressing your Self, as a Uber-Conservative. No epiphenomenalism here! It's all geopolitics now, and to the Right of Prime Minister Netanyahu. "Let's Kick-Azz and get-er Done!"

            You don't mind if I criticize you, do you? Now that you are to the Right of Ronald Reagan, who back in the day you considered to be 'bad' and 'extreme'?

             
          • kohana posted at 8:29 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            I love the 1st amendment, even the very ignorant of all biblical scholarship, can post their drivel.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 6:38 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            fish posted at 5:49 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013

            IABD- Your post has more to say than all of HTC's 6839 insults. Thank you for your comment.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 6:19 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            fish: Conservative God grants his followers permission to be as nasty, hateful, selfish and greedy as they want to as long as they have a Jesus fish on their car and constantly tell people how blessed they are.

            HTC: Really? The God of the Bible condemned covetousness and theft as much as anything and that's exactly what is at the heart of liberal politics: envy of the rich, coveting of their wealth and the 'legalization' of the theft of their wealth by the government.

            Your hypocrisy is nearly as bright as that attributed by believers to the star of Bethlehem.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 6:11 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            who new posted at 1:07 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013

            If the MSM weren't in bed with the Democrats, we'd have seen one Watergate-like expose after another over the past 4 years.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 6:08 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            kohana posted at 11:52 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013

            Krauthammer nailed it with that piece.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 6:05 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            Do any inquiring minds wanting to know more about our current "zeitgeist"?
            If the Torah forbids a Jewish state, why should it become the US's 51st state?
            Why are Orthodox Jews opposed to the Zionist State of Israel?

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&v=9oeB3QhX2RI&NR=1

            Why have Canadian Jews denounced Israeli war threats against Iran?

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfiE1BshUn8

            Zionism and the Third Reich

            http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v13/v13n4p29_Weber.html

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 6:04 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            kohana: On Wednesday, Rasmussen Reports released the results of a poll revealing that only "74% of American Adults continue to believe the U.S. Constitution guarantees the right of an average citizen to own a gun."

            HTC: Of course, now tht SCOTUS has ruled in D.C. v. Heller that it IS an individual right, there's no excuse for the other 26% who still don't believe that the Second Amendment confers such an individual right; however, that 26% is roughly the same percentage of Americans who self-label themselves as "progressives" or "liberals", a group that never has had a solid grip on reality.

            The good news is that three-fourths of Americans do get it and that should help keep many within Congress in check when it comes to Obama's request that they carry his water for him on this issue. He can't be reelected, but reelection is always a major issue for them. Democrats haven't forgotten the butt-kicking they got the first time they passed an "assault" weapons ban, nor the fact that they suffered the same fate in 2010 for forcing Obama's 'stimulus' and ObamaCare on us.

            Many Dems are hoping to take back the house in 2014 and they know that passing another assault weapons ban is a good way to guarantee that doesn't happen.

            Of course, I could be wrong about this as I tend to expect most people to behave rationally and Obama's reelection proves that not to be the case any longer.

             
          • fish posted at 5:49 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            fish Posts: 130

            Ha ha. I love the Conservatives version of God. I've been going to church my whole life and I'm yet to figure out where they are getting their info. For the record, I'm a liberal which Conservative-version-of-God will tell you that being liberal makes you a Godless heathan who supports terrorism.

            The God I grew up on was adament about taking care of the poor. "Conservative God" says the poor are lazy; we must taketh away.

            The God I know said "it is harder for a rich man to enter heaven, than it is for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle." Conservative God says "the rich are job creators so they are immune to the laws the rest of live by and reckless greed is something we embrace because it drives the economy".

            My God tells me to love my fellow man and to not pass judgment because that's his (or her) job. Conservative God says "love your fellow man... as long as they are not gay, muslim, liberal, athiest, PETA-ish, poor, or illigally living in 'Merica."

            My God created 13 different types of hermaphrodites. (That's right, there are 13 documented types of people walking around with both male and female sex organs. Thats TYPES, not numbers, there are tens of thousands of hermaphrodites living among us). Conservative God says "just ignore that. Those were mistakes. Being gay is a choice. It's not like anyone was ever born mixed up in the first place."

            Conservative God grants his followers permission to be as nasty, hateful, selfish and greedy as they want to as long as they have a Jesus fish on their car and constantly tell people how blessed they are.

            Outside of an anonymous blog, I will just keep my faith in God to myself and keep my politics in the best interest of all of humanity; whether they have a Jesus fish on their car or not.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 5:48 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Montana should consider doing this as well:

            http://washingtonexaminer.com/wyoming-lawmakers-propose-bill-to-nullify-new-federal-gun-laws/article/2518133#.UO_Yq6wmE9g

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 4:59 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Rob123: Nope.....Just a couple combat veterans who understand the waste of war. Very hard to explain that to a Chicken-Hawk.

            HTC: Yeah, the Revolutionary War was a complete waste; after all, the progressives have already nearly completely dismantled the Constitution.

            WW II was also a complete waste. I mean, German is a noble language and their engineers are some of the best in the world. Why get all worked up over the tyrannical aspects of the Third Reich and the killing of a few million Jews, right?

            And just because these appointees refuse to call a terrorist a terrorist, even when they've declared war against us, doesn't make them chickens or idiots.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 4:53 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            kohana: Those of us who would fight for our freedoms, and support our Constitution, in Rob123's opinion are "chicken-hawks."

            HTC: There must still be some Canadian blood flowing in his veins.

             
          • jennydoe posted at 4:18 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            jennydoe Posts: 2198

            thankyou Bronco for showing us that if we really look for gGod that we can find gGod in just about anything.
            but I must adhere to my Flying Spaghetti Monster theory, which leads me to wonder if Frank's middle name starts with an 'S'

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 3:04 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            kohana posted at 11:52 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            IABD- Your Washington Post article by Charles Krauthammer, Published: January 10, 2013,
            stated: "The puzzle of the Chuck Hagel nomination for defense secretary is that you normally choose someone of the other party for your Cabinet to indicate a move to the center."

            Chuck Hagel is a member of the GOP and is not a chickenhawk. Even if President Obama selected Chuck Norris as the Secretary of Defense, the neo-conservative GOP would still protest.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 2:42 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            "After Reagan's inauguration as President, Chuck Hagel was named deputy administrator of the Veterans Administration. In 1982, however, he resigned his post over a disagreement with VA Administrator Robert P. Nimmo, who was intent on cutting funding for VA programs. Nimmo had referred to veterans groups as "greedy", and to Agent Orange as not much worse than a "little teenage acne".

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuck_Hagel

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 2:37 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQCOHUXmEZg

             
          • kohana posted at 2:10 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            who new posted at 1:07 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013

            Excellent post. Max and his ilk have been sucking at the hog teats for so long most don't even notice anymore. We have a 17 year-old high school student in Flathead County, that may make a difference come the next election for Max. Hopefully, he will be tossed out on his posterior.

             
          • Rick Spencer posted at 1:57 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            Rick Spencer Posts: 405

            Here is the best 'gun culture' article that I have read during the the run up to Biden's report. I have also included the FAQ it produced. RLS


            http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/the-riddle-of-the-gun/

            And, his following FAQ.

            http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/faq-on-violence

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 1:20 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            5 Reasons Natural Gas Won’t Be an Environmental and Economic Savior

            January 10, 2013
            This article was published in partnership with GlobalPossibilities.org [3].

            If you’re hoping the natural gas boom means we’ve solved our environmental and economic woes, you’re going to be disappointed. While natural gas produces less nitrogen oxides and carbon dioxide when burned compared to coal or oil, the end product is only part of the story. The natural gas boom in recent years has been fueled by extreme extraction methods like fracking that are posing a new slurry of environmental problems before the gas even makes it to consumers.

            If you look at the complete picture of how we extract natural gas today, you begin to realize pretty quickly that we aren’t going to be able to drill our way out of the climate crisis without creating an even bigger mess in the process. The list of impacts from fracking is huge, but here are five to kick off the conversation:

            1. Methane

            Natural gas may release less pollution when burned, but it still may be a significant contributor to global warming pollution after all because we must take into account what happens during extraction, too. “Scientists are once again reporting alarmingly high methane emissions from an oil and gas field, underscoring questions about the environmental benefits of the boom in natural-gas production that is transforming the US energy system,” writes [4] Jeff Tollefson for Nature. He explains [4]:

            The researchers, who hold joint appointments with the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) and the University of Colorado in Boulder, first sparked concern in February 2012 with a study suggesting that up to 4% of the methane produced at a field near Denver was escaping into the atmosphere. If methane — a potent greenhouse gas — is leaking from fields across the country at similar rates, it could be offsetting much of the climate benefit of the ongoing shift from coal- to gas-fired plants for electricity generation.

            Industry officials and some scientists contested the claim, but at an American Geophysical Union (AGU) meeting in San Francisco, California, last month, the research team reported new Colorado data that support the earlier work, as well as preliminary results from a field study in the Uinta Basin of Utah suggesting even higher rates of methane leakage — an eye-popping 9% of the total production. That figure is nearly double the cumulative loss rates estimated from industry data — which are already higher in Utah than in Colorado.

            When it comes to climate change, leaking methane is a big deal. The EPA reports [5], “Pound for pound, the comparative impact of CH4 [methane] on climate change is over 20 times greater than CO2 over a 100-year period.

            2. Water Pollution

            Methane released during fracking doesn’t just end up in the air, but also in the water. By now you’ve likely already seen the videos of people living near gas drilling operations who can light their water on fire as it comes out of the tap. (If you haven’t then it’s time to see “Gasland [6].”) In 2011 the United States Geological Survey released a report about water in Pavillion, Wyoming where residents complained about water quality after drilling. Here’s what they found [7]:

            EPA’s analysis of samples taken from the Agency’s deep monitoring wells in the aquifer indicates detection of synthetic chemicals, like glycols and alcohols consistent with gas production and hydraulic fracturing fluids, benzene concentrations well above Safe Drinking Water Act standards and high methane levels. Given the area’s complex geology and the proximity of drinking water wells to ground water contamination, EPA is concerned about the movement of contaminants within the aquifer and the safety of drinking water wells over time.

            Other studies have show the same, including one published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences. Abrahm Lustgarten writes [8]for ProPublica:

            The research was conducted by four scientists at Duke University. They found that levels of flammable methane gas in drinking water wells increased to dangerous levels when those water supplies were close to natural gas wells. They also found that the type of gas detected at high levels in the water was the same type of gas that energy companies were extracting from thousands of feet underground, strongly implying that the gas may be seeping underground through natural or manmade faults and fractures, or coming from cracks in the well structure itself.

            And that’s just the methane. Frack fluid that is injected into the wells contains a toxic soup of hundreds of chemicals, including carcinogens and volatile organic compounds like benzene, toluene, ethylbenzene and xylene. Companies aren’t required to disclose what chemicals they’re using either — so it makes it difficult to test for leaks and spills, and for people to be treated for health problems that may arise from exposure.

            Oh yeah, and fracking is exempt from the Safe Drinking Water Act — thanks Dick Cheney!

            3. Water Consumption

            Fracking is water intensive. It can take anywhere from 2 million to 13 million gallons of water to frack a single well and more water is needed to drill the well. Additionally wells are often fracked multiple times, some times as many as 18 times. Where does all that water come from? The Pacific Institute reports [9]:

            Water for hydraulic fracturing is typically withdrawn from one location or watershed over several days. Additionally, in some cases, the water is taken from “remote, often environmentally sensitive headwater areas” (Beauduy 2011, 34), where even small withdrawals can have a significant impact on the flow regime. As a result, while fracking may account for a small fraction of a state’s or even a basin’s water supply, there can be more severe local impacts.

            Additionally, much of the water injected underground is either not recovered or is unfit for further use once it is returned to the surface, usually requiring disposal in an underground injection well. This water use represents a “consumptive” use if it is not available for subsequent use within the basin from which it was extracted. In some cases, water is treated and reused for subsequent fracking jobs, although this is still fairly uncommon, and no national estimate on the prevalence of this practice is available.

            Already states like Texas and Pennsylvania have run into conflicts with fracking due to water shortages. And things are likely to get worse, as the Pacific Institute states [9], “In many basins, the application of fracking is still in its infancy and continued development could dramatically increase future water requirements and further intensify conflicts with other uses.”

            4. Trucks

            How does all the water water and chemicals get to drilling sites? Trucks, trucks and more trucks [10]. In Pennsylvania it was estimated that drilling and fracking a single well can result in 1,000 truck trips. For residents in rural areas, this means a constant stream of trucks barreling along small roads, some unpaved. Residents have complained of pollution from idling diesel trucks, roads that aren’t big enough for the vehicles, dust pollution on unpaved roads, and excessive wear and tear on bridges and pavement. The results have been accidents galore [11] and big bills for taxpayers.

            Jim Efstathiou Jr. wrote [12] for Business Week:

            A surge in hydraulic fracturing to get gas and oil trapped in rock means drillers need to haul hundreds of truckloads of sand, water and equipment for a single well. Drilling that added jobs and tax revenue for many states also has increased traffic on roads too flimsy to handle the 80,000-pound (36,300 kilogram) trucks that serve well sites.

            The resulting road damage will cost tens of millions of dollars to fix and is catching officials from Pennsylvania to Texas off guard. Measures to ensure that roads are repaired don’t capture the full cost of damage, potentially leaving taxpayers with the bill, according to Lynne Irwin, director of Cornell University’s local roads program in Ithaca, New York.

            ... Last month, [Texas’] Transportation Commission approved $40 million to repair roads near the Barnett Shale in North Texas and the Eagle Ford Shale in South Texas.

            5. Economic Fallout

            So much for the economic boom that fracking was suppose to create for small towns. The road repairs are just the start. In one of the most heavily drilled counties in the Marcellus Shale, a hospital CEO in Pennsylvania is now blaming the gas drilling industry for an operating loss. The AP reported [13]:

            Jersey Shore Hospital president and CEO Carey Plummer told the Sun-Gazette of Williamsport that many subcontractors attracted to the area’s Marcellus Shale drilling boom do not cover employees.

            That has brought a growing number of uninsured people to the community-owned, nonprofit hospital, Plummer said.

            “We had a loss,” Plummer said. “I don’t think it’s a sign of the economy. I think it’s the influx of the gas, industry and those who lack insurance.”

            Homeowners may also stand to lose. The Huffington Post reported [14], “Nationwide Mutual Insurance Co. has become the first major insurance company to say it won't cover damage related to a gas drilling process that blasts chemical-laden water deep into the ground.” The company released a memo that said:

            After months of research and discussion, we have determined that the exposures presented by hydraulic fracturing are too great to ignore. Risks involved with hydraulic fracturing are now prohibited for General Liability, Commercial Auto, Motor Truck Cargo, Auto Physical Damage and Public Auto (insurance) coverage.

            While the fracking industry promises to create jobs, those like Tish O’Dell, co-founder of the Cleveland-area group Mothers Against Drilling in Our Neighborhoods, wonder about what jobs will be lost from impacts to farming, tourism and dairies. She told Midwest Energy News [15], “If you were going to do a really serious study you would look at these things,” she said. “If water is contaminated and fish die, what are the fishermen going to do? If you have parks where people go for peace and quiet, what happens when you turn it into an industrial landscape? If you have an organic dairy and the soil is polluted, what does that mean? These are all valid questions.”

            See more stories tagged with:
            fracking [16],
            water [17],
            health [18],
            gas [19],
            drilling [20]
            Source URL: http://www.alternet.org/fracking/5-reasons-natural-gas-wont-be-environmental-and-economic-savior
            Links:
            [1] http://www.alternet.org
            [2] http://www.alternet.org/authors/tara-lohan
            [3] http://globalpossibilities.org/
            [4] http://www.nature.com/news/methane-leaks-erode-green-credentials-of-natural-gas-1.12123#/b1
            [5] http://epa.climatechange.html
            [6] http://www.gaslandthemovie.com/
            [7] http://www.desmogblog.com/2012/09/29/usgs-fracking-study-confirms-methane-contamination-drinking-water-pavillion-wyoming
            [8] http://www.propublica.org/article/scientific-study-links-flammable-drinking-water-to-fracking
            [9] http://www.pacinst.org/reports/fracking/full_report.pdf
            [10] http://www.alternet.org/hot-news-views/deadly-truck-traffic-list-impacts-fracking-grows
            [11] http://www.alternet.org/fracking/4-scary-new-finds-about-fracking-week
            [12] http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-05-15/taxpayers-pay-as-fracking-trucks-overwhelm-rural-cow-paths-1-.html
            [13] http://www.pressconnects.com/viewart/20121224/NEWS11/312240043/Gas-field-workers-cited-Pa-hospital-s-losses
            [14] http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/13/nationwide-insurance-fracking_n_1669775.html
            [15] http://www.midwestenergynews.com/2013/01/10/u-s-chambers-fracking-job-boom-behind-the-numbers/
            [16] http://www.alternet.org/tags/fracking-0
            [17] http://www.alternet.org/tags/water-0
            [18] http://www.alternet.org/tags/health-0
            [19] http://www.alternet.org/tags/gas-0
            [20] http://www.alternet.org/tags/drilling-0
            [21] http://www.alternet.org/%2Bnew_src%2B

             
          • who new posted at 1:07 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            who new Posts: 367

            I’m not nearly concerned about Islamic terrorists as I am about Montana Senators getting their palms greased.

            http://washingtonexaminer.com/tim-carney-max-baucus-rewards-ex-staffers-with-tax-breaks-for-their-clients/article/2517635#.UPBsufKH-Sp

             
          • kohana posted at 12:48 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            January 11th, 2013

            A Lesson to be Learned on the Anniversary of Wounded Knee

            December 29, 2012 marked the 122nd Anniversary of the murder of 297 Sioux Indians at Wounded Knee Creek on the Pine Ridge Indian Reservation in South Dakota. These 297 people, in their winter camp, were murdered by federal agents and members of the 7th Cavalry who had come to confiscate their firearms "for their own safety and protection".

            The slaughter began AFTER the majority of the Sioux had peacefully turned in their firearms. When the final round had flown, of the 297 dead or dying, two thirds (200) were women and children.

            Around 40 members of the 7th Cavalry were killed, over half cut down by friendly fire from the Hotchkiss guns of their overzealous comrades-in-arms. Twenty members of the 7th Cavalry were deemed "National Heroes" and awarded the Medal of Honor for their acts of cowardice.

            We do not hear of Wounded Knee today. It is not mentioned in our history classes or books. What little does exist about Wounded Knee is normally the sanitized "Official Government Explanation" or the historically and factually inaccurate depictions of the events leading up to the massacre on the movie screen.

            Wounded Knee was among the first federally backed gun confiscation attempts in United States history. It ended in the senseless murder of 297 people.

            Before you jump on the emotionally charged bandwagon for gun-control, take a moment to reflect on the real purpose of the Second Amendment- The right of the people to take up arms in defense of themselves, their families, and property in the face of invading armies or an oppressive government. The argument that the Second Amendment only applies to hunting and target shooting is asinine. When the United States Constitution was drafted "hunting" was an everyday chore carried out by men and women to put meat on the table each night, and "target shooting" was an unheard of concept, musket balls were a precious commodity in the wilds of early America, and were certainly not wasted "target shooting". The Second Amendment was written by people who fled oppressive and tyrannical regimes in Europe, and refers to the right of American citizens to be armed for defense purposes should such tyranny rise in the United States.

            ............

            Ask any Native American, and they will tell you it was inferior technology and lack of arms that contributed to their demise. Ask any Armenian why it was so easy for the Turks to exterminate millions of them, and they will answer "We were disarmed before it happened". Ask any Jew what Hitler's first step prior to the mass murders of the Holocaust was- confiscation of firearms from the people.

            Wounded Knee is the prime example of why the Second Amendment exists, and why we shouldn't be in such a hurry to surrender our Right to Bear Arms. Without the Second Amendment we have no right to defend ourselves and our families.

            Author Unknown
            http://jpfo.org/alerts2013/alert20130111.htm

            Read the Indian history of the American West by Dee Brown, Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee, pub 1971.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 12:38 pm on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/01/10/1177628/-Republicans-see-Hagel-pick-as-rejection-of-neoconservative-views-Well-nbsp-duh

             
          • kohana posted at 11:52 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109


            The meaning of Hagel

            By Charles Krauthammer, Published: January 10, 2013, Washington Post

            “This is my last election. After my election, I have more flexibility.”

            — Barack Obama to Dmitry Medvedev, March 26, 2012

            The puzzle of the Chuck Hagel nomination for defense secretary is that you normally choose someone of the other party for your Cabinet to indicate a move to the center, but, as The Post’s editorial board pointed out, Hagel’s foreign policy views are to the left of Barack Obama’s, let alone the GOP’s. Indeed, they are at the fringe of the entire Senate.

            So what’s going on? Message-sending. Obama won reelection. He no longer has to trim, to appear more moderate than his true instincts. He has the “flexibility” to be authentically Obama.

            Hence the Hagel choice: Under the guise of centrist bipartisanship, it allows the president to leave the constrained first-term Obama behind and follow his natural Hagel-like foreign policy inclinations. On three pressing issues, in particular:

            (1) Military Spending

            Current Defense Secretary Leon Panetta said in August 2011 that the scheduled automatic $600 billion defense cuts (”sequestration”) would result in “hollowing out the force,” which would be “devastating.” And he strongly hinted that he might resign rather than enact them.

            Asked about Panetta’s remarks, Hagel called the Pentagon “bloated” and needing “to be pared down.” Just the man you’d want to carry out a U.S. disarmament that will shrink America to what Obama thinks is its proper size on the world stage; i.e., smaller. The overweening superpower that Obama promiscuously chided in his global we-have-sinned tour is poised for reduction, not only to fund the bulging welfare state — like Europe’s postwar choice of social spending over international relevance — but to recalibrate America’s proper role in the world.

            (2) Israel

            The issue is not Hagel’s alleged hostility but his public pronouncements. His refusal to make moral distinctions, for example. At the height of the second intifada, a relentless campaign of indiscriminate massacre of Israelis, Hagel found innocence abounding: “Both Israelis and Palestinians are trapped in a war not of their making.”

            This pass at evenhandedness is nothing but pernicious blindness. Just last month, Yasser Arafat’s widow admitted on Dubai TV what everyone has long known — that Arafat deliberately launched the intifada after the collapse of the Camp David peace talks in July 2000. He told his wife to stay in the safety of Paris. Why, she asked? Because I’m going to start an intifada.

            In July 2002, with the terror still raging, Hagel offered further exquisite evenhandedness: “Israel must take steps to show its commitment to peace.” Good God. Exactly two years earlier Israel had proposed an astonishingly generous peace that offered Arafat a Palestinian state — and half of Jerusalem, a previously unimaginable Israeli concession. Arafat said no, made no counteroffer, walked away and started his terror war. Did no one tell Hagel?

            (3) Iran

            Hagel doesn’t just oppose military action, a problematic option with serious arguments on both sides. He actually opposed any unilateral sanctions. You can’t get more out of the mainstream than that.

            He believes in diplomacy instead, as if talk alone will deter the mullahs. He even voted against designating Iran’s Revolutionary Guard Corps as a terrorist organization at a time when they were supplying and supporting attacks on U.S. soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan.

            Most tellingly, he has indicated that he is prepared to contain a nuclear Iran, a position diametrically opposed to Obama’s first-term, ostensibly unalterable opposition to containment. What message do you think this sends the mullahs?

            And that’s the point. Hagel himself doesn’t matter. He won’t make foreign policy. Obama will run it out of the White House even more tightly than he did in the first term. Hagel’s importance is the message his nomination sends about where Obama wants to go. The lessons are being duly drawn. Iran’s official media have already cheered the choice of what they call this “anti-Israel” nominee. And they fully understand what his nomination signals regarding administration resolve about stopping them from going nuclear.

            The rest of the world can see coming the Pentagon downsizing — and the inevitable, commensurate decline of U.S. power. Pacific Rim countries will have to rethink reliance on the counterbalance of the U.S. Navy and consider acquiescence to Chinese regional hegemony. Arab countries will understand that the current rapid decline of post-Kissinger U.S. dominance in the region is not cyclical but intended to become permanent.

            Hagel is a man of no independent stature. He’s no George Marshall or Henry Kissinger. A fringe senator who left no trace behind, Hagel matters only because of what his nomination says about Obama.

            However the Senate votes on confirmation, the signal has already been sent. Before Election Day, Obama could only whisper it to his friend Dmitry. Now, with Hagel, he’s told the world.

            http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/charles-krauthammer-the-meaning-of-hagel/2013/01/10/12a37c48-5b5f-11e2-9fa9-5fbdc9530eb9_print.html

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 11:25 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            kohana posted at 11:04 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            IABD- Rob123 served in the military.

            A chickenhawk is a person in a position of public prominence or power who displays two traits:
            Aggressive support for military force as a primary instrument of foreign policy.
            A documentable lack of combat experience.


            Here is a short list of prominent chickenhawks:
            Glenn Beck
            George W. Bush
            Dick Cheney
            Tom Delay
            Larry Elder
            Newt Gingrich
            Sean Hannity
            Stephen Harper
            Christopher Hitchens
            William Kristol
            Scooter Libby
            Joe Lieberman
            Rush Limbaugh
            Trent Lott
            Ted Nugent
            Bill O'Reilly
            Dan Quayle
            Karl Rove
            Paul Wolfowitz

             
          • kohana posted at 11:04 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            Those of us who would fight for our freedoms, and support our Constitution, in Rob123's opinion are "chicken-hawks."

             
          • kohana posted at 11:03 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            January 11, 2013

            Self Governance is Under Attack, not just the Second Amendment

            Neil Snyder

            On Wednesday, Rasmussen Reports released the results of a poll revealing that only "74% of American Adults continue to believe the U.S. Constitution guarantees the right of an average citizen to own a gun." This finding is perplexing because the Constitution hasn't changed. You can actually see it in the National Archives, and right there in the Bill of Rights you will find the Second Amendment. It reads as follows:

            A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

            The language in the Second Amendment isn't vague or confusing. Since only 74% of our fellow citizens believe that we have a constitutional right to own guns, it's safe to conclude that roughly a quarter of our population isn't familiar with our founding document and the principles that it sets forth. That's disheartening because our forefathers fought and died to secure those rights for us, and we're in the process of frittering them away.

            The Bill of Rights was included in the Constitution because the people demanded it. They were fearful that the United States of America would become something altogether different from the nation that they fought to create unless those rights were specifically enumerated in the Constitution itself.

            As it turns out, their fears were justified. One-by-one, our founding principles are coming under attack, and one-by-one, they are being abrogated. For example, something as seemingly innocuous as healthcare has pitted the United States government against Christians throughout the nation thanks to Obamacare, and our First Amendment rights have been trampled upon.

            The Federalist Papers is a collection of 85 essays that were written by Alexander Hamilton, James Madison, and John Jay to convince the people of our fledgling country to support the Constitution. They lay out the arguments for the creation of a form of government that Abraham Lincoln referred to as "of the people, by the people, and for the people" in his Gettysburg Address.

            In the Declaration of Independence, Thomas Jefferson wrote:

            We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes...

            The constitutional issues being decided upon today threaten to remake this nation into something that our Founding Fathers would not have tolerated, much less supported. It's time for us to decide if we still believe in self governance. If we do, are we willing to defend that governing principle? Stated another way, is our country's government still of the people, by the people, and for the people, or is it a dictatorship? The answer to those questions will determine the kind of nation that we leave to future generations.

            History teaches that the world is full of tyrants who would like to control us. Will we let them?

            http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2013/01/self_governance_is_under_attack_not_just_the_second_amendment.html

            Neil Snyder is the Ralph A. Beeton Professor Emeritus at the University of Virginia. His blog, SnyderTalk.com, is posted daily.

             
          • Bronco posted at 10:37 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            a changinG wOrlD. (I did it!)

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 10:27 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            Rob123 posted at 8:23 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            The scientific dilemma you present now becomes whether or not the recent urban survivalists having moved to the NW Montana area with their newly constructed High Tech Crappers.
            These HTC's are merely outdoor compost toilets with NRA magazines for wipe.
            Would HTC still be able to decompose at this lower temperature?

             
          • kohana posted at 10:25 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            Another American source:

            January 11, 2013

            Hagel: Why Him, Why Now?

            By Jerrold L. Sobel

            Love him or hate him, one thing for sure, this president loves a good fight even when it's not necessary. Take this latest nomination of former Nebraskan Senator Chuck Hagel for Secretary of Defense.

            As most people know by now, this controversial pick has stirred up a hornet's nest of controversy not only amongst friends of Israel on both sides of the aisle but also within the gay and lesbian community as well.

            Prior to his nomination, President Obama made reference to remarks Hagel made in 1998 about President Clinton's nomination for ambassador to Luxembourg, James Hormel. Hagel characterized Hormel as being "openly aggressively gay" and claimed it would inhibit him from doing an "effective" job. He has recently apologized for these offensive remarks but for those born earlier than the day before yesterday, including Hormel, the sting is still there.
            In a recent interview, the ambassador had this to say:

            "I have not received an apology," Hormel, who is a major figure in Democratic politics, told me. "I thought this so-called apology, which I haven't received, but which was made public, had the air of being a defensive move on his part." Hormel added that the apology appeared to have been given "only in service of his attempt to get the nomination."

            Obama, flush with victory, and with the mindset of a fullback smashing through the line, is set to push the nomination through. He had this to say:

            "With respect to the particular comment that you quoted, he apologized for it," He continued. "And I think it's a testimony to what has been a positive change over the last decade in terms of people's attitudes about gays and lesbians serving our country. And that's something that I'm very proud to have led."

            Really? If the president is correct, that's some change of heart Hagel has experienced over the last 15 years. In 1996 he said he would have voted for the Defense of Marriage Act, which prohibits federal recognition of same sex marriages. Likewise, in 1999 he also said he was opposed to repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell," the ban on openly gay men and women serving in the military which was repealed in 2010.

            The president and his proponents themselves must have recently undergone an epiphany. Just weeks ago they were blasting Mitt Romney for opposing gay marriage and for what they deemed were anti-gay positions.

            Moving from one slighted community to another, the Hagel nomination has also rankled the feathers of the pro-Israel community.

            In an article published in National Review Online, "Hagel: The Wrong Man," Alan Dershowitz, a lifelong liberal Democrat and strong supporter of President Obama, opines that confirmation of Chuck Hagel would be sending a wrong message to the mullahs of Iran. According to him, it would be interpreted by them as meaning the military option is off the table. It would also encourage them to ratchet up their pursuit of nuclear weapons without fear of a U.S. attack. The same message would likewise be sent to Israeli leaders, increasingly dubious that the U.S. would attack Iran in any event even if that were the only option.

            Proving that opposition to the Hagel nomination surmounts partisan politics, Dershowitz goes on to quote a recent Washington Post editorial:

            Mr. Hagel repeatedly voted against sanctions, opposing even those aimed at the Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps, which at the time was orchestrating devastating bomb attacks against U.S. troops in Iraq. He argued that direct negotiations, rather than sanctions, were the best means to alter Iran's behavior.

            Mr. Obama has said that his policy is to prevent Iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon and that containment is not an option. Mr. Hagel has taken a different view, writing in a 2008 book that "the genie of nuclear weapons is already out of the bottle, no matter what Iran does.

            From every tier on the American political spectrum, voices are cascading down against the Hagel nomination.

            Lt. Col. Bob Maginnis (USA-Ret.), now senior fellow for national security at the Family Research Council (FRC), says that Hagel does not have the experience needed to run a vast and complex operation like the U.S. Department of Defense:

            "You have a budget of $660 billion a year. It's a place that should be run by people who have spent their entire life learning these processes, and unfortunately, Mr. Hagel hasn't spent much more than two years in the Army; 45 years ago," Maginnis points out. "That does not qualify him to run the most complex armed forces in the world today."
            Jordan Sekulow, an attorney at the American Center for Law and Justice (ACLJ) has this to say:

            "[Hagel] voted against sanctions on Iran. He voted against labeling the Iranian Revolutionary Guard as a terror organization. He encouraged the EU not to vote and adopt Hezbollah as a terrorist organization." .... "He encourages direct dialogue with Hamas, direct dialogue with Hezbollah, direct dialogue with Iran without any consequences for them. This is the wrong person for Secretary of Defense."

            Despite these valid arguments against confirmation, Obama pushes on. Hagel may still carry the day but it won't be without a fight. Although none have come out publicly against him, several senators within the Democratic Party are, at the very least, tepid over his nomination.

            Freshman Sen. Tammy Baldwin (D-WI), the first openly gay senator, promised to question Hagel on his aforementioned "aggressively gay" comments. Democratic Sen. Carl Levin (MI), Richard Blumenthal (CT), and Sen. Mazie Hironi (HI) also withheld judgment whether he deserves the job. From the president's perspective many others are deafeningly noncommittal.

            Far less noncommittal are Republican senators such as Lindsey Graham of South Carolina. He's quoted as saying:

            "This is an in-your-face nomination by the president to all of us who are supportive of Israel."

            Abe Foxman, the head of the Anti-Defamation League (ADL) who usually walks lockstep with Obama is with Graham on this one. He blasted Hagel for his 2006 derisive use of the term, Jewish lobby. Foxman isn't alone in the Jewish and pro-Israel community for this and other innuendos Hagel has uttered:

            "The Jewish lobby intimidates a lot of people. ...I've always argued against some of the dumb things they do".... "I'm not an Israeli senator. I'm a United States senator. I support Israel, but my first interest is, I take an oath of office to the Constitution of the United States, not to a president, not to a party, not to Israel."

            In summation, Hagel's hurtful words are only exceeded by his actions:

            ● October 2000: he was one of only four senators who refused to sign a Senate letter in support of Israel.
            ● In July 2001, he was one of only two senators to vote against extending the original Iranian sanctions bill.
            ● November 2001: he was one of only 11 senators who refused to sign a letter urging President Bush not to meet with the late Yasser Arafat until his forces ended the violence against Israel.
            ● June 2004, he refused to sign a letter urging President Bush to highlight Iran's nuclear program at the G-8 summit and was one of only two senators in to vote against renewal of the Libya-Iran sanctions act.
            ● December 2005: he was one of only 27 senators who refused to sign a letter to President Bush urging him to pressure the Palestinian Authority (PA) to ban terrorist groups from participating in Palestinian legislative elections.
            ● In July 2006, at the outbreak of the Lebanon war, Hagel argued against giving Israel the time to break Hezbollah, urging instead an immediate ceasefire.
            ● In August 2006, he was one of only 12 Senators who refused to formally call upon the European Union to designate Hezbollah as a terrorist organization.

            It should be quite obvious to people without an axe to grind. In word and deed, Chuck Hagel is the wrong man for secretary of defense. His confirmation would not serve the strategic interests of the United States or its allies and if anything, it would embolden the aspirations of our enemies. Other than unquestionable valorous service in Viet Nam, he has absolutely no bona fides for this job. With so many presumptive negatives and so many qualified and experienced alternates to choose from, one has to question, why him, why now?

            http://www.americanthinker.com/2013/01/hagel_why_him_why_now.html#ixzz2HgjEKv3D

             
          • kohana posted at 10:07 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            Try reading all the articles in the American Thinker for a week Rob. Maybe that would be more palatable to you.

            January 11, 2013
            Who might be domestic enemies of our Constitution?
            K.E. Campbell

            Article VI, clause 3 of the U.S. Constitution reads

            The Senators and Representatives before mentioned...shall be bound by Oath or Affirmation, to support this Constitution...

            Accordingly, on January 3rd, members of the 113th U.S. Congress took the following oath
            I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter.

            Who might be domestic enemies of our Constitution? ……………….
            ………………………………….

            Hazlitt had much more to convey about the dictatorial trend, the enemy within, and their tactics and techniques. I recommend reading the entire article and other of his books and publications. We are far down the road Hazlitt warned us about -- due in large part to U.S. Senators' and Representatives' forsaking of their sworn duty to "support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic."

            Read more:

            http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2013/01/who_might_be_domestic_enemies_of_our_constitution.html#ixzz2HgfLXQ2W


             
          • kohana posted at 9:54 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            Rob123 posted at 2:49 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013

            If you were to read more conservative web sites, you would find the same information all over the internet with the same concerns by people from all different varieties of life. However, Melanie Philips writes so well that she puts the information together in logical sequence. However, she is a Jew and she does live in London, thus her opinion has no meaning for you. I only post articles from her that seem to have meaning as to what is happening to us in the USA. But, you really should subscribe yourself, because she also relates to what is happening to the UK by the muslims, with huge segments of the country that are "no go zones" where police, firemen, and emergency personnel are afraid to go.

            I have friends and family that served in Vietnam and are absolutely sickened by these 3 people coming into powerful offices. It doesn't bother you that these people are in bed with Islam? Are you looking forward to your beautiful granddaughters being forced to wear a burka in 20 years or less? Maybe with FGM forced on them? Non of these things give you concern in our (at the moment) retaliative free country?

            You'd rather ridicule Melanie Phillips because she is a Jew and make degrading remarks to me. Way to go!


             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 9:47 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            SAN DIEGO—Following the events of last week, in which a crazed western lowland gorilla ruthlessly murdered 21 people in a local shopping plaza after escaping from the San Diego Zoo, sources across the country confirmed Thursday that national gorilla sales have since skyrocketed.

            “After seeing yet another deranged gorilla just burst into a public place and start killing people, I decided I need to make sure something like that never happens to me,” said 34-year-old Atlanta resident Nick Keller, shortly after purchasing a 350-pound mountain gorilla from his local gorilla store. “It just gives me peace of mind knowing that if I’m ever in that situation, I won’t have to just watch helplessly as my torso is ripped in half and my face is chewed off. I’ll be able to use my gorilla to defend myself.”

            “Law enforcement and animal control can only get there so quickly,” Keller added. “And you never know when you’ll need to use a gorilla to save your life.”

            Reports confirmed that gorilla sales have historically risen sharply in the immediate aftermath of a major gorilla attack, most notably after the 2010 tragedy in the small town of Logan, NM, where 14 people, including two 5-year-old children and a 92-year-old woman, were viciously beaten to death by a 12-year-old gorilla who spontaneously attacked patrons of a crowded grocery store.

            The latest attack marked the fifth of its kind in the United States within the last six months and has reignited the explosive national debate over gorilla control, with thousands of outraged Americans reportedly demanding that their government representatives act immediately in order to prevent further bloodshed.

            “We’ve had to deal with too many gorilla-related tragedies, and we’ve had to bury too many innocent, feces-covered victims,” said Nicole Simmons, president of the Mothers Against Gorillas coalition, who herself lost her 16-year-old son in the infamous Baker High School gorilla rampage of 1997. “It’s time to put an end to this. We need to get gorillas off the streets once and for all. Enough is enough.”

            “The answer to this systemic problem is not more gorillas,” Simmons continued, her eyes welling with tears. “The answer is fewer gorillas.”

            As evidence, Simmons pointed to a 2011 University of Maryland study, which found that 98 percent of Americans who own a gorilla have never used them for defense against a home invasion. Simmons also cited widely reported studies confirming that people who keep gorillas in the home are 12 times more likely to have their arms torn off, and children in those households are 19 times more likely to be picked up by the legs and bashed repeatedly into the ground.

            Furthermore, many gorilla control advocates have reportedly called for statewide limits to the number of gorillas one can purchase and a federal ban on the ownership of silverbacks, referencing as an example the tight gorilla laws in countries such as Japan, England, and Australia, where the annual rate of gorilla crimes is virtually nonexistent.

            “There is absolutely no reason—not for hunting, protection, or otherwise—that an ordinary citizen would need to possess a 600-pound silverback,” said Sen. Robert Menendez (D-NJ), one of the most outspoken gorilla control advocates in Congress. “The general public frankly has no business owning apes of this size, and the only people who do are zookeepers who are trained to properly handle them. Otherwise, they are nothing but a threat to society and only serve to perpetuate more violence.”

            Opponents to gorilla control legislation, however, appear to be fervent in their defense of their gorilla possession rights. A spokesperson for the powerful yet controversial national gorilla lobby told reporters that a ban on gorillas would not end incidents such as that in San Diego, as those who want the large primates could simply buy them from illegal dealers who smuggle them into the country from the jungles of sub-Saharan Africa.

            Many gorilla owners also told sources that the creatures are primarily used for legal hunting purposes and that the overwhelming majority of gorilla enthusiasts are completely responsible with their apes.

            “Listen, it’s my God-given right as an American to have the freedom to own a gorilla to protect myself and my family,” said Nashua, NH resident James Harrington, 46, adding that he personally owns 12 different gorillas of various sizes, but keeps them “safely locked away in [his] home.” “And the government has another thing coming if they think they can come into my house and take away my gorillas.”

            “What happened in San Diego was horrible, but that doesn’t mean all gorillas are bad,” Harrington added. “In fact, if every person at that mall had a gorilla, then the tragedy probably never would have even happened in the first place.”

            At press time, following the increase in national gorilla sales, four isolated gorilla attacks had just been reported across the country, with the overall civilian death toll currently estimated at 37.

            http://www.theonion.com/articles/gorilla-sales-skyrocket-after-latest-gorilla-attac,30860/

             
          • Rob123 posted at 8:23 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=quantum-gas-goes-below-absolute-zero&WT.mc_id=SA_WR_20130109

            Quantum Gas Goes below Absolute Zero
            Ultracold atoms pave way for negative-Kelvin materials

             
          • Rob123 posted at 8:21 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            HighTechCowboy posted at 7:08 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.
            Posts: 6832
            Rob123 posted at 2:49 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013
            1.No comment on the nominees themselves? 2.Just an attack on the messenger?
            -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
            1. Nope.....Just a couple combat veterans who understand the waste of war. Very hard to explain that to a Chicken-Hawk.
            2. Yup.....Sign up for her emails, and read along with her for awhile.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 7:21 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Franchises Squeezed Tightly by ObamaCare
            By Kate Rogers
            January 11, 2013

            Dan Drennen says his franchisees are sitting on their hands. According to the general manager of Visiting Angels Living Assistance Services, multi-unit franchisees are withholding expansion in the face of the Affordable Care Act’s employer mandate.

            “The cost becomes exponentially greater,” Drennen said. “They are subject to the ACA and it’s a law of diminishing returns.”

            Drennen said single owner deals continue to come in, as Visiting Angels has 437 franchise locations, and near 420 individual franchisees. But for many of those nearing the 50-employee level, where the employer mandate kicks in and health-care is a requirement or a $2,000 annual penalty per employee is due, they’re staying put.

            “Everyone is in a holding pattern,” he said. “In the last year, we have between 30 and 40 [multi-franchise] deals that have been held off, because it’s not a perfectly clear picture.”

            Paul Mangiamele, CEO of Bennigan’s, said he has several multi-store agreements with franchisees that have been shelved since the ACA became law. Bennigan’s franchises cost $35,000 in fees to open per location, Mangiamele said. If someone signs a five- store deal with the franchise, Bennigan’s charges $35,000 for the first store, and a $10,000 deposit upfront for the remaining four locations.

            So the expansion slowdown not only halts job growth under the Bennigan’s name, but withholds the company from collecting about $100,000 in fees.

            “This very mandate will stifle the growth that the administration touts it will help,” Mangiamele said. “It’s puzzling how this makes sense for anyone in D.C. These are jobs that would impact high unemployment.”

            Mangiamele has 82 Bennigan’s locations across 15 states, with 55 franchisees. He personally offers health insurance to his corporate office’s 12 employees, even though he doesn’t have to under the new requirements.

            “We do the right thing, and don’t need a mandate to do it,” he said.

            Don Fox, CEO of Firehouse of America, a restaurant franchise, said he plans to bring his franchisees together next month for a health-care summit. His multi-location franchisees, those with five or more restaurants, will discuss how the law impacts their businesses.

            “If [a franchisee] is in a five-store agreement, for our brand, opening restaurant number five means the mandate will apply. In essence, what I have done is put my entire investment for restaurant number five toward offering paying for health care. So why open it?” he said.

            He offers 100% coverage for his full-time workers at his 30 restaurants, and is ballparking costs at near $5,000 per worker once the law kicks in, he said, and the Treasury Department offers up the guidelines for what constitutes “adequate” coverage.

            Drennen said he is hopeful the franchise and small-business community will be able to weather the challenges the ACA presents.

            “I don’t think the act is insurmountable,” he said. “The demographic is in our favor, and I am optimistic about it.”

            http://smallbusiness.foxbusiness.com/legal-hr/2013/01/10/franchises-squeezed-tightly-by-health-care-law/#ixzz2Hg1LwYXv

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 7:12 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            kohana: In any healthy society, they would be considered marginal, third-rate figures....

            HTC: In a healthy society, Obama would be lucky to win an election for dog catcher but could certainly never attain the Oval Office.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 7:08 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Rob123 posted at 2:49 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013

            No comment on the nominees themselves? Just an attack on the messenger?

             
          • Rob123 posted at 2:49 am on Fri, Jan 11, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            Kohana: "He (Hagel) gave vent to primitive anti-Jewish conspiracy theory by moaning that ‘the Jewish lobby intimidates a lot of people here’ (in Washington DC)."

            "These three men, Hagel, Brennan and Kerry, are all examples of post-Vietnam demoralisation syndrome – the deeply pessimistic belief that America cannot and should not fight to defend its security and values anywhere in the world; that if bad people are defeated in war only worse people will ever take their place; and that therefore the best strategy for America is to buy them all off, pull up the drawbridge and retreat into a self-delusional isolation."

            http://www.melaniephillips.com/

            After being on Melanie's mailing list for a year, and reading her dispatches, one tires of a Right Winger beating the Drum of Jewish Nationalism tied to London International Banking and American Military muscle......"Take 2 Midol and call me in the morning!".

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 7:48 pm on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5TCj4gKri_c

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 7:23 pm on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            kohana posted at 6:17 pm on Thu, Jan 10, 2013

            kohana: "We are going to need gGod or somebody on our side at the rate Obama is going."

            IABD: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eKEe3VzA4Y

             
          • kohana posted at 6:17 pm on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            We are going to need gGod or somebody on our side at the rate Obama is going.

             
          • kohana posted at 5:56 pm on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            http://www.melaniephillips.com/

            The twilight of America

            I think this is what is called a slam dunk. Barack Obama has now proposed filling the three positions in the US administration most concerned with the security of the nation and the defence of the free world, those at State, Defence and the CIA, by three men who have all taken up positions which can only strengthen those who threaten the security of America and the survival of the free world.

            Obama proposes to instal as Secretary of Defence Chuck Hagel. Six years ago, Senator Hagel refused to sign a letter pressing the European Union to declare the Iranian-backed Hezbollah militia, which has bombed US targets and killed and kidnapped Americans and other westerners, a terrorist organisation. He repeatedly voted against sanctions against Iran, opposing even those aimed at the Iranian Revolutionary Guards which had orchestrated bomb attacks against U.S. troops in Iraq.

            He gave vent to primitive anti-Jewish conspiracy theory by moaning that ‘the Jewish lobby intimidates a lot of people here’ (in Washington DC). He has also made comments about gay people which are deemed to be ‘homophobic’. No matter – not even this most lethal of accusations from his own support base has deflected Obama’s intention to appoint him.

            Next, Obama proposes to make John Brennan head of the CIA. Brennan – who unlike the rest of the English-speaking world is said to refer to Jerusalem only by its Arabic name, al Quds -- has consistently downplayed, misunderstood and sought to appease Islamic terrorism and extremism.

            In 2008, Brennan wrote in The Annals of the American Academy of Political and Social Science:

            ‘A critical step toward improved US-Iranian relations would be for US officials to cease public Iran-bashing, a tactic that may have served short-term domestic political interests, but that has heretofore been wholly counterproductive to U.S. strategic interests.’

            In 2010, Brennan said this about Hezbollah:

            ‘There is [sic] certainly the elements of Hezbollah that are truly a concern to us what they’re doing. And what we need to do is to find ways to diminish their influence within the organisation and to try to build up the more moderate elements.’

            Anyone ever heard of a ‘moderate’ Hezbollah member?

            In another twist, Brennan faces publicly expressed hostility from the left who claim that he has supported the CIA’s interrogation tactics which included waterboarding – a claim he denies. No matter – not even this visceral reaction from his own support base has deflected Obama’s intention to appoint him.

            Then there is Obama’s pick for Secretary of State John Kerry, who came home from Vietnam a decorated war hero and then turned viciously against the military and the exercise of American power.

            Like Hagel, Kerry has been a supporter of Syria's President Assad. In 2010, Kerry met Assad and called Syria

            ‘an essential player in bringing peace and stability to the region’.

            Name an enemy of civilised values – Daniel Ortega of Nicaragua, Castro in Cuba – and you find Kerry urging engagement with them or, as he did with FARC, the Colombian narco-terrorist group, claiming they have ‘legitimate complaints’. Last year Kerry praised Egypt’s ruler Mohamed Morsi for ‘protecting fundamental freedoms, including women’s rights, minority rights, the right to free expression and assembly’; shortly afterwards, Morsi assumed dictatorial powers (later modified under pressure) and his forces were beating up opponents in the street.

            These three men, Hagel, Brennan and Kerry, are all examples of post-Vietnam demoralisation syndrome – the deeply pessimistic belief that America cannot and should not fight to defend its security and values anywhere in the world; that if bad people are defeated in war only worse people will ever take their place; and that therefore the best strategy for America is to buy them all off, pull up the drawbridge and retreat into a self-delusional isolation.

            These are people who are the living embodiment of civilisational exhaustion and decline. In any healthy society, they would be considered marginal, third-rate figures characterised variously by moral spinelessness, stupidity and knuckle-dragging prejudice. Yet not only has Obama put such people forward to manage the security of America, at a time when Iran is racing to build its nuclear bomb and Islamic radicals are destroying lives and freedom across the world and making headway into the west -- in part because of the policies of Obama himself; even more stunningly, the American liberal media, along with timid or ideologically partisan US Jewish leaders, remain silent about these astoundingly destructive appointments because it is Obama who is making them.

            No wonder Iran is purring that it looks forward to a new and closer relationship with the US. It thinks that now it will have a clear run to producing its nuclear bomb -- the weapon which not only threatens genocide against the Jewish people who these three treat with such contempt and worse, but threatens the American people and the free world with the civilisational jihad that this trio so obtusely refuse to acknowledge for the mortal threat to life and liberty that it actually represents.

            If these three appointments are confirmed, Obama will have removed the last vestiges of independent thinking from his security and foreign policy team and honed his administration to deliver his uninterrupted vision for changing the geopolitical balance of the world. The fear is that, against the pivotal threat of our time, this will entail failing to prevent Iran from achieving nuclear capability while putting the screws on Israel to abandon its own nuclear arsenal. Thus the genocidal aggressor will be empowered, while its principal putative victim will be left defenceless --and the west will belatedly wake up to the fact that it is in a war it cannot win.

            Beyond terrifying. Beyond belief.

            http://www.melaniephillips.com/

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 4:37 pm on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            HighTechCowboy posted at 3:01 pm on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            HTC-"It seems obvious to me that our chances of reforming federal spending have passed us by and our only hope now is "libertarianism via bankruptcy."

            IABD- Mr. H, Sorry, but the best you can hope for is mental bankruptcy by extraterrestrial alien abduction.

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUvEyclQjdI

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 3:01 pm on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            who new: One has to be a brave politician indeed, to tell voters the truth contrary to what they believe.

            HTC: Good post.

            Unfortunalely, I fear that such an honest and brave politician has almost no chance of getting elected, at least in enough numbers to be effective in Congress. People don't want to hear the truth, preferring sweet-sounding lies to reality. That preference by a majority of the electorate is what got Obama reelected.

            It seems obvious to me that our chances of reforming federal spending have passed us by and our only hope now is "libertarianism via bankruptcy."

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 2:53 pm on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Pete: The Need for Semi-Automatic "Assault" Weapons

            HTC: Those who insist that no one needs such a firearm are simply ignorant of history and of firearms in general. Typically, they're the same idiots like Feinstein who call a cartridge a "bullet" when it is only the projectile which is called by that name.

            The proper term for firearms which have been ignorantly labeled by progressives as "assault" weapons is "tactical rifle" which is the term that those who train SWAT teams and special forces use to describe them. They are physically different in appearance than hunting rifles because they're designed for a different purpose, which is dealing with armed human predators versus unarmed food for the table.

            Their characteristics make them particularly well suited for home defense, especially against multiple bad guys with bad intentions or perps wearing lower threat-level vests which would stop most handgun rounds (perps wearing such vests have grown in numbers, leading some states to enact special "aggravated" penalties for committing a crime while wearing one):

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-q2zHIovOE

            Some people wrongly claim that the .223 is prone to "overpenetration", making it unsuitable for use in urban environments, but actual testing has proven that the 9mm, especially +P versions, is far more prone to overpenetration of typical building materials.

             
          • Pete posted at 2:51 pm on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            who new posted at 11:27 am on Thu, Jan 10, 2013

            [thumbup][thumbup]

             
          • jennydoe posted at 11:54 am on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            jennydoe Posts: 2198

            If we let gGod take over our world, will he provide? Or are you all mistaking gGod for the Flying Spaghetti Monster as this self-proclaimed prophet clearly is?
            --------

            Most Americans probably think that companies like Vibram and Dow Chemical are responsible for the technology behind long-lasting shoes, but self-proclaimed prophet Cindy Jacobs is asserting that durable kicks are really a “supernatural” miracle from God.

            During the Tuesday episode of God Know, Jacobs advised viewers to gather provisions for “the tumultuous season ahead,” but not to worry because God would provide through miracles.

            “We believe we’re moving into a supernatural season, where if needed, God will multiply food,” she explained. “I have seen God multiply food more than one time when I was cooking… And I remember spooning out spaghetti or whatever, just praying in the spirit over that, and God just made more and more and more. You know, I’ve seen oil multiply as I was praying for the sick. I’ve seen bottles of oil just fill up about a cup a time of oil. But the point is we were promised supernatural provisions.”

            “Remember when we drove our car… one one set of tires, how many miles was it?” Jacobs asked her husband and fellow prophet, Mike, after the commercial break. “Way, way beyond what could ever happen with one set of tires.”

            She continued: “I mean, I remember one time that I had a pair of shoes that I wore and wore and wore and wore and it just — for years, these shoes did not wear out. And I wore them years and years and years.”

            “So, you know, sometimes God is saying little epiphanies to us, little things to us, but we don’t know how to listen to his voice.”

            Raw Story (http://s.tt/1ycxr)

             
          • who new posted at 11:27 am on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            who new Posts: 367

            HTC: “I wish that Mr. Tanner had also pointed out that the cost of entitlements and the welfare state is growing so rapidly that the CBO estimates that they will comprise over 90% of the federal budget by the end of THIS decade.”

            One of the most common misconceptions I hear when talking to people about the fiscal mess in Washington, is their belief that our problems would be solved if we just eliminated all the waste, fraud, and abuse in government, at all levels. This includes welfare to people who don’t deserve it, contracts to businesses as favors from politicians, $200 toilet seats, four government employees to screw in a light bulb, and the like. This is their justification for believing they deserve their Social Security and Medicare benefits, because if we only eliminated the waste, fraud, and abuse problems, these programs could still exist.

            One has to be a brave politician indeed, to tell voters the truth contrary to what they believe.

             
          • Rob123 posted at 11:18 am on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyK_9rsd-p4

            HighTechCowboy posted at 9:43 am on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            I was just trying to stay on topic, I guess.....no use dreaming, eh?

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 10:49 am on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            HTC- "You're never going to meet an alien due to the laws of physics which make such visitations virtually impossible."

            IABD- Mr. H, in your narcissistic view of the universe where the sun apparently in your mind revolves around your massive brain floating in space brings up the question: Why would an advanced alien want to have visitation with you anyway?

            FYI:The necessary building blocks of life including water have been arriving on earth from comets and meteors for billions of years. Even FOX science reports has mentioned this. "Rant on, my delusional friend, for I'm done with you. There's no sense in trying to communicate with those whose feet don't touch the ground." - HTC :)

            http://www.reuters.com/article/2009/08/18/us-space-comet-life-idUSTRE57H02I20090818

             
          • mooseberryinn posted at 10:35 am on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            mooseberryinn Posts: 2697

            iabd - Was there a point to your post? (0958 today).
            Anyway - Ya just gotta love old Joe Biden. He just struts right on up there and kicks the anthill with his "Executive Order" gun control line. Could be he doesn't know what the 2nd amendment says? It appears there are millions willing to tell him. What a great buffoon. He does provide lots of laughs.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 9:58 am on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            HighTechCowboy posted at 7:13 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013

            HTC-"It's a beautiful day posted at 6:51 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013"

            "HTC-Rant on, my delusional friend, for I'm done with you. There's no sense in trying to communicate with those whose feet don't touch the ground. Post away but I'll be ignoring you from this point on."

            HighTechCowboy posted at 9:37 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            "IABD: http://nemoarms.com/"

            "HTC: I just may have to get one of those 300 Winchester Magnum ARs. That's an excellent cartridge which packs quite a punch."

            IABD- Major General Paul E Vallely, U.S. Army (Retired) also the CEO of Nemo Arms, a Kalispell, Montana firearms manufacturing company also manufactures:
            WORLD’S FIRST TITANIUM AR .308 RIFLE for a mere – $100,000 per unit. This war toy should include a luxury tax, and environmental impact fees added on for you wealthy fatcats. Are the US taxpayers actually expected to pay for these weapons for our soldiers as well?

            Vallely is also a FOX NEWS military analyist. (FYI: 50 percent of HTC's posts are FOX NEWS cut and paste, with the other half insults.)

            Paul Vallely as CEO of his other website http://www.standupamericaus.org/ strangely operates as .org/ indicating non-profit status. Is there no profit made running as a right-wing terrorist propaganda mill expressing the opinions of President Nixon's infamous Watergate burglars?

            "The Stand Up America US Project (SUA) was founded in 2005 by Paul E. Vallely, (MG US Army Ret), as a multi-media organization that involves publishing, radio, television, speaking engagements, web site, writing articles for publication as well as books.

            This site is meant as a resource for education, based upon the values and principles set forth by our founding fathers. It is our goal to inform, clarify, and speak truth to power.

            We are a network of patriotic Americans from all walks of life including former members of the military, former federal, state, and local employees of government, analysts, writers, world leaders, and our group extends across the globe.

            SUA Founder Paul E. Vallely Bio
            Paul E. Vallely, (Major General, US Army Ret) was born in DuBois, Pa. He retired in 1991 from the US Army as Deputy Commanding General, US Army, Pacific in Honolulu, Hawaii. General Vallely graduated from the US Military Academy at West Point and was commissioned in the Army in 1961 serving a distinguishing career of 32 years in the Army.

            General Vallely is a graduate of the Infantry School, Ranger and Airborne Schools, Jumpmaster School, the Command and General Staff School, The Industrial College of the Armed Forces and the Army War College. His combat service in Vietnam included positions as infantry company commander, intelligence officer, operations officer, military advisor and aide-de-camp. He has over fifteen (15) years experience in Special Operations, Psychological and Civil-Military Operations." -http://www.standupamericaus.org/

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 9:43 am on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Rob123 posted at 2:45 am on Thu, Jan 10, 2013

            HTC: Before we start speculating about life elsewhere in the universe, logic dictates that we must first explain how it came about here and we're a LONG way away from succeeding at that task.

            But if we should manage that feat, of what use is that speculation about life elsewhere? You're never going to meet an alien due to the laws of physics which make such visitations virtually impossible.

             
          • Pete posted at 9:35 am on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            The Need for Semi-Automatic "Assault" Weapons

            http://townhall.com/columnists/katiepavlich/2013/01/10/the-need-for-semiautomatic-assault-weapons-n1485999?utm_source=thdaily&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=nl

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 8:30 am on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            who new: Does anyone see a pattern here?

            HTC: Mr. Tanner very succinctly describes the major fiscal problem that we face as well as the pattern of fiscal recklessness and irresponsibility consistently displayed by Obama and his party. I wish that Mr. Tanner had also pointed out that the cost of entitlements and the welfare state is growing so rapidly that the CBO estimates that they will comprise over 90% of the federal budget by the end of THIS decade.

            It is true that we cannot tax and/or grow our way out of this problem and everyone (except he idiots that voted for Obama) realizes that, including most of the leadership of the Democratic Party.

            So why do they refuse to entertain the serious and significant reductions in spending that are needed to keep us from going off the REAL fiscal cliff?

            The answer is quite simply this: Most of those cuts would have to come from our massive nanny state spending which has enabled the Democratic Party to build the large constituency which it enjoys today. To cut them off would mean the simultaneous dismantling of the Democratic Party.

            They're simply not going to do that and would prefer to put our entire nation, our economy and out childrens' futures at risk rather than surrender the power they've spent the last 80 years acquiring.

            Are the Republicans blameless? Of course not. The RINOs and neocons such as G.W. Bush have also dramatically grown government and Bush's Medicare Part D benefit is bleeding red ink even faster than the rest of Medicare or Social Security.

            Current GOP resistance to cutting defense spending is wrong-headed but it should not occur without the far greater cuts to the nanny state which must also occur if we are to end our race to economic doom. Starting with Reagan, the GOP has agreed to tax increases and cuts in other areas on the promise from the Democrats that they would work next on cuts in social spending. But the Democrats have always broken those promises and are not to be trusted. The GOP must currently hold ground on any more tax increases or discretionary cuts until the Democrats finally deliver the needed social spending cuts. They've had thirty years of lying and stalling within which to finally produce such a plan and the ball is now squarely in THEIR court.

            Congressmen need to also get the pork out of defense spending which is wasting tens of billions of dollars every year on weapons and programs which the DoD doesn't need or want but which maintain jobs in politicians' districts. We also have to accept the fact that we simply cannot afford to be the world's cop.

            It seems extremely unlikely that Washington will get real and make the deep cuts needed to get our debt under control. We will continue to kick the can down the road until the situation finally blows up in our faces. Many economists estimate that day is coming within the next 10-15 years. Some predict an earlier arrival.

            Let us hope that its arrival brings "libertarianism by bankruptcy" and not a form of tyranny that history teaches is all too often the result of economic collapse.

             
          • Rob123 posted at 2:45 am on Thu, Jan 10, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            HighTechCowboy posted at 8:09 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.
            Posts: 6825
            Rob123: http://www.universetoday.com/99309/nearly-all-sun-like-stars-have-planetary-systems/
            HTC: But so far they've had no luck identifying any that could support life as we know it. The search for such planets has only reinforced our world's uniqueness.

            Seamus Heaney references Narcissus in his poem "Personal Helicon" from his first collection "Death of a Naturalist":
            "To stare, big-eyed Narcissus, into some spring
            Is beneath all adult dignity."

            As you know, so far our technology for observing the 100 billion stars in our Milky Way, only allows us to record shadows-moving dark spots-that indicate around 18 billion Earth or Earth X 2 size objects circling a Sun at a distance that would indicate basic conditions similar, possibly, to Earth. We haven't even begun to observe the surface of such objects......However, there is a good chance that when the technology becomes advanced enough to actually see what's there, well Narcissus, hang on! It might not be 'Life as we know it'. E-gads, eh? People will flock to the feet of fredh (fredh posted at 3:05 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013) for a plausible meme they can live with, while others will write books championing the cause of Discovery and Learning despite the Debt......After all, it's the poor people who cause debt, not Fat Cats and their over taxed Corporations? http://articles.latimes.com/2013/jan/03/business/la-fi-billionares-gain-20130103

             
          • who new posted at 11:30 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            who new Posts: 367

            “We are not going to tax our way out of debt. We are not going to grow our way out of debt. And we are not going to get out of debt by trimming “fraud, waste, and abuse.” It’s time to face the fiscal facts.”

            The Fiscal Facts of Life
            Spending less is the only way we can get out of debt.

            By Michael Tanner

            Having completed yet another deficit-reduction agreement that somehow managed to increase the deficit, Congress and the Obama administration are now laying the groundwork for upcoming fights over the debt ceiling, the sequester, and the continuing resolution that will fund the government given continued refusal by Senate Democrats to pass a budget.

            But before sitting down to negotiate another deal that will kick the problem down the road, perhaps our legislators could use a refresher course on the fiscal facts of life.

            Let’s start with the basics. This year, the federal government will spend at least $3.62 trillion, an increase of almost $92 billion from last year. Of that amount, we will borrow $941 billion, or 26 percent. Indeed, our deficit this year is almost equal to the entire federal budget in 1985. And, in reality, spending will likely be even higher, since almost every year sees additional “emergency” expenditures as well. Thus, when all is said and done, expect our deficit to actually end up exceeding $1 trillion for the fifth consecutive year.

            Our national debt, which can be thought of as the cumulative total of our annual levels of fiscal irresponsibility, reached $16.4 trillion this month. This already technically exceeds the debt ceiling that was agreed to less than a year and a half ago. It is worth noting that our debt at that time was just $14.3 trillion, meaning we have added $2.1 trillion to the debt since the last time we promised to cut spending as a trade-off for agreeing to more debt.

            Our debt currently exceeds 102 percent of GDP, if one considers both debt held by the public and intragovernmental debt (such as the Medicare and Social Security Trust Funds), so we now owe more than the value of all goods and services produced in this country over the course of a year. It’s much as if your credit-card bills exceeded your entire pre-tax salary.

            Worse, that likely understates the true size of our indebtedness. If one includes the full future unfunded liabilities of Social Security and Medicare, this country’s real indebtedness could run as high as $129 trillion (in current dollars). Even under the most optimistic scenarios, our real debt approaches $80 trillion. Measured as a percentage of GDP, our total debt exceeds the debt of Greece or Spain.

            The debt burden means that economic growth will be lower in the future. For example, the International Monetary Fund looked at the relationship between federal debt levels and economic growth, concluding that from 1890 to 2000, countries with high debt levels consistently saw their economies grow at slower rates than those with low debt levels. Similarly, Carmen Reinhardt of the University of Maryland and Harvard’s Kenneth Rogoff conclude that countries with a debt ratio above 90 percent of GDP have median growth rates 1 percent lower than countries with a lower debt, and average growth rates nearly 4 percent lower.

            If economic growth stays as slow as it has been lately, but spending stays high, our debt-to-GDP ratio will get bigger, slowing economic growth further and creating a devilish sequence of cause and effect.
            At the same time, there is no possible way to tax our way out of this debt. As much as President Obama wants to keep talking about taxing the rich, there isn’t enough money there to solve our fiscal problems. In 2010, millionaires and billionaires in America earned $840 billion. At these levels, even confiscating all of their income would not cover the post-fiscal-cliff-deal 2013 budget deficit, leaving a shortfall of almost $100 billion. If you wanted to go after the debt, you would have to confiscate their entire wealth, estimated at roughly $11 trillion according to the Census Bureau, and you would still fall short of paying off the feds’ credit card. Of course you could only do this once, and you would very likely wreck the economy in the process.

            In 2008, the Congressional Budget Office estimated that in order to simply pay for then-projected spending, we would have to raise both the corporate tax rate and the top individual tax rate to 88 percent, raise the rate for middle-income workers to 63 percent, and raise the rate for low-income Americans to 25 percent. Given the explosion of spending in the last four years, those rates would have to be even higher today.

            Does anyone this side of Paul Krugman believe we can sustain taxes at that level?

            That means the only real solution must be on the spending side of the equation. Yet, we must recognize that there is no easy or painless way to cut spending to the degree it needs to be cut. For example, foreign aid amounts to just one percent of federal spending. Federal subsidies to Planned Parenthood and the Corporation for Public Broadcasting amount to a combined two one-hundredths of a percent. Indeed, all domestic discretionary spending this year, after adjusting for the fiscal cliff deal, will total just $628 billion. You could abolish all of it and you would still have a deficit this year of more than $312 billion.

            Domestic discretionary spending amounts to 18 percent of all federal spending. Interest on the debt amounts to another 6 percent, but that is essentially untouchable. This leaves defense (19 percent) and entitlement programs, notably Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid, which consume 46 percent of federal spending. (Another 11 percent goes to other entitlements, homeland security, and a few additional categories.)

            That is why it is so disappointing that Republicans are working to undo the sequester for defense spending, while President Obama is keeping entitlement reform off the table. Frankly, there is no way to balance the budget or reduce the debt if 71 percent of the budget (defense plus entitlements plus interest payments) is uncuttable.

            Unfortunately, we have been here before. In 2011, we had a fight over the Continuing Resolution funding the government. After a near government shutdown, Congress and the president promised to do something about the deficit and overspending. A few months later, we had a crisis over the debt ceiling. Congress and the president promised to do something about the deficit and overspending. Two weeks ago, we almost fell off the fiscal cliff. Congress and the president promised to do something about the deficit and overspending.

            Does anyone see a pattern here?

            We are not going to tax our way out of debt. We are not going to grow our way out of debt. And we are not going to get out of debt by trimming “fraud, waste, and abuse.” It’s time to face the fiscal facts.

            — Michael Tanner is a senior fellow at the Cato Institute and author of Leviathan on the Right: How Big-Government Conservatism Brought Down the Republican Revolution.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 9:55 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            IRS' Watchdog calls tax code 'unconscionable burden'
            January 9, 2013

            The country’s top taxpayer advocate urged Congress on Wednesday to simplify the tax code, saying it is the most serious problem facing taxpayers and that individuals and businesses spend about 6.1 billion hours annually complying with tax-filing requirements.

            The analysis and recommendation are included in the 2012 report to Congress by the national taxpayer advocate, the IRS' internal watchdog.

            “The existing tax code makes compliance difficult, requiring taxpayers to devote excessive time to preparing and filing their returns,” tax advocate Nina Olson wrote in the 756-page report to Congress. “And it undermines trust in the system by creating an impression that many taxpayers are not compliant, thereby reducing the incentives that honest taxpayers feel to comply.”

            The report follows Washington Democrats and Republicans agreeing last week to a deal that permanently extended lower tax rates for families making less than $400,000 annually but failed to address comprehensive tax reform.

            The Republican-controlled House has vowed this session to attempt to overhaul the system but earlier attempts have been unsuccessful.

            The report also states the tax code imposes an “unconscionable burden” on taxpayers, pointing out that Congress over roughly the past 11 years has made about 5,000 changes to the tax code, which now totals about 4 million words.

            By eliminates all tax credits, Congress could cut individual income tax rates by 44 percent and still generate the same amount of revenue it collects under current rules, the report states.

            An analysis of IRS data by the Taxpayer Advocate Service shows the 6.1 million hours that individuals and businesses spent with tax-filing requirements is the equivalent of more than 3 million full-time workers.

            “If tax compliance were an industry, it would be one of the largest in the United States,” the report states.

            Olsen also said the IRS is under-funded, which hurts taxpayers in part because the agency cannot do enough to help victims of tax-related identity theft and fraudulent tax-form preparation.

            “Each dollar appropriated for the IRS generates substantially more than one dollar in additional revenue,” she stated. “It is therefore ironic and counterproductive that concerns about the deficit are leading to cuts in the IRS budget, when those cuts are making the deficit larger.

            The country’s top taxpayer advocate urged Congress on Wednesday to simplify the tax code, saying it is the most serious problem facing taxpayers and that individuals and businesses spend about 6.1 billion hours annually complying with tax-filing requirements.

            The analysis and recommendation are included in the 2012 report to Congress by the national taxpayer advocate, the IRS' internal watchdog.

            “The existing tax code makes compliance difficult, requiring taxpayers to devote excessive time to preparing and filing their returns,” tax advocate Nina Olson wrote in the 756-page report to Congress. “And it undermines trust in the system by creating an impression that many taxpayers are not compliant, thereby reducing the incentives that honest taxpayers feel to comply.”

            The report follows Washington Democrats and Republicans agreeing last week to a deal that permanently extended lower tax rates for families making less than $400,000 annually but failed to address comprehensive tax reform.

            The Republican-controlled House has vowed this session to attempt to overhaul the system but earlier attempts have been unsuccessful.

            The report also states the tax code imposes an “unconscionable burden” on taxpayers, pointing out that Congress over roughly the past 11 years has made about 5,000 changes to the tax code, which now totals about 4 million words.

            By eliminates all tax credits, Congress could cut individual income tax rates by 44 percent and still generate the same amount of revenue it collects under current rules, the report states.

            An analysis of IRS data by the Taxpayer Advocate Service shows the 6.1 million hours that individuals and businesses spent with tax-filing requirements is the equivalent of more than 3 million full-time workers.

            “If tax compliance were an industry, it would be one of the largest in the United States,” the report states.

            Olsen also said the IRS is under-funded, which hurts taxpayers in part because the agency cannot do enough to help victims of tax-related identity theft and fraudulent tax-form preparation.

            “Each dollar appropriated for the IRS generates substantially more than one dollar in additional revenue,” she stated. “It is therefore ironic and counterproductive that concerns about the deficit are leading to cuts in the IRS budget, when those cuts are making the deficit larger.

            “The plain truth is that the IRS’s mission trumps all other agencies’ missions, because without an effective revenue collector, you can’t fund those other agencies.”

            http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/01/09/irs-watchdog-tax-code-unconscionable-burden-asks-congress-to-reform-system/#ixzz2HXrogegb

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 9:37 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            IABD: http://nemoarms.com/

            HTC: I just may have to get one of those 300 Winchester Magnum ARs. That's an excellent cartridge which packs quite a punch.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 9:12 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            Making way for guns in a changing world.

            Mr. Frank Miele- I assume you were a former wannabee superpatriotic columnist for the teaparty GOP who now claims to no longer need or desire to personally own or possess a firearm as a requirement to live and work in a peaceful society. I commend you for your courage to say this last week. I did however find one of your 2012 columns online at: http://www.standupamericaus.org/corruption-2/mansour-and-obama-those-chicagomuslim-ties-back-to-1979/

            We can assume you were never forced against your will or at gunpoint to write these columns for:
            Major General Paul E Vallely, U.S. Army (Retired) who is the Chairman and CEO of Stand Up America and resident of Bigfork, Montana
            http://www.standupamericaus.org/

            Vallely is also the CEO of Nemo Arms, a Kalispell, Montana firearms manufacturing company.
            http://nemoarms.com/
            NEMO Arms
            3582 Hwy 93 S
            Kalispell, Montana 59901

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 7:24 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I85ApzR43jU :)

             
          • kohana posted at 5:36 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109


            bill39 posted at 5:07 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013
            Do you expect he'll place his hand on the Bible and swear to uphold the constitution?

            I doubt it, as he didn't the first time around. He flubbed the words, and Roberts took the blame that all the words weren't said properly, then claimed he had the slime ball repeat them in private, which nobody ever saw nor heard. However, if a person doesn't believe in a gGod in the first place, having them swear on a bible is pointless. Of course, he claims he is a Christian, but then so does Jeremiah Wright as he damns American, Americans, our flag, and Jews.

             
          • Bronco posted at 5:33 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            fredh-"Women's Role: Women weren't made to be passionate sex partners. There mission in life
            is to be mothers,which also means custodian of morality, and music, religion, and culture."
            ----------------------------------
            So you're a rigid believer in the missionary position? And the 'custodians of religion' aren't allowed into the priesthood? And women keep all the morals while men get a pass? You're a Muslim, I presume. Good old-fashioned, man-on-top-get-it-over-with-quick.
            As far as 'women weren't made to be passionate sex partners' goes, I guess Satan made multi-orgasmic women...and gays. Kinda awesome that gGod thinks the same way you do, huh?

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 5:07 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            HighTechCowboy posted at 4:35 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013

            Bronco: I've been here three times longer than you but you've posted twice as many comments. Yap-yap-yap-yap...

            HTC: "No surprises there. I know a he// of a lot more than you and therefore have more to share with others.
            Maybe if you spent less time on the beach and more time reading about the important issues in life, you'd have something of value to offer as well."

            IABD- It takes selfless volunteerism like Bronco's to help clean up the beaches of Hawaii after Japan's crisis. Do you have a more important service to offer life on this planet other than eternal vigilance and war versus maintaining it's survival?

             
          • bill39 posted at 5:07 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            bill39 Posts: 1057

            kohana posted at 10:08 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Do you expect he'll place his hand on the Bible and swear to uphold the constitution?

             
          • kohana posted at 5:02 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Judaism/chosen_people.html

            The "Chosen People"

            In Judaism, "chosenness" is the belief that the Jewish people were singularly chosen to enter into a covernant with G-d. Most Jews hold that being the "Chosen People" means that they have been place on earth to fulfill a certain purpose. Traditional proof for Jewish "chosenness" is found in the Torah, the Jewish bible, in the Book of Deuteronomy (chapter 14) where it says: "For you are a holy people to Hashem your God, and God has chosen you to be his treasured people from all the nations that are on the face of the earth." In the Book of Genesis (chapter 17) it also written: "And I [G-d] will establish My covenant between Me and you [the Jewish people] and your descendants after you in their generations, for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and your descendants after you."

            This tradition of "chosenness," though, has often provoked antagonism from non-Jews.

            In the 1930s, as the Nazis were tightening the noose around the necks of German Jews, George Bernard Shaw remarked that if the Nazis would only realize how Jewish their notion of Aryan superiority was, they would drop it immediately. In 1973, in the aftermath of the Yom Kippur War, Yakov Malik, the Soviet ambassador to the United Nations, said: "The Zionists have come forward with the theory of the Chosen People, an absurd ideology. That is religious racism." Indeed, the most damaging antisemitic document in history, the forgery known as The Protocols of the Elders of Zion, is based on the idea of an international conspiracy to rule the world by the "Chosen People."

            In light of these attacks, it is not surprising that some Jews have wanted to do away with the belief in Jewish chosenness. The most noted effort to do so was undertaken by Rabbi Mordecai Kaplan, founder of the small but influential Reconstructionist movement. Kaplan advocated dropping chosenness for two reasons: to undercut accusations of the sort made by Shaw that the Chosen People idea was the model for racist ideologies, and because it went against modern thinking to see the Jews as a divinely chosen people.

            But does it? After all, how did the notion of one God become known to the world? Through the Jews. And, according to Jewish sources, that is the meaning of chosenness: to make God known to the world. As Rabbi Louis Jacobs has written: "We are not discussing a dogma incapable of verification, but the recognition of sober historical fact. The world owes to Israel the idea of the one God of righteousness and holiness. This is how God became known to mankind."

            Does Judaism believe that chosenness endows Jews with special rights in the way racist ideologies endow those born into the "right race"? Not at all. The most famous verse in the Bible on the subject of chosenness says the precise opposite: "You alone have I singled out of all the families of the earth. That is why I call you to account for all your iniquities" (Amos 3:2). Chosenness is so unconnected to any notion of race that Jews believe that the Messiah himself will descend from Ruth, a nonJewish woman who converted to Judaism.

            Why were the Jews chosen? Because they are descendants of Abraham. And why were Abraham and his descendants given the task of making God known to the world? The Torah never tells us. What God does say in Deuteronomy, is that "it is not because you are numerous that God chose you, indeed you are the smallest of people" (7:7). Because of the Jews' small numbers, any success they would have in making God known to the world would presumably reflect upon the power of the idea of God. Had the Jews been a large nation with an outstanding army, their successes in making God known would have been attributed to their might and not to the truth of their ideas. After all, nonMuslims living in the Arab world were hardly impressed by the large numbers of people brought to Islam through the sword.

            Nonetheless, perhaps out of fear of sounding selfrighteous or provoking antisemitism, Jews rarely speak about chosenness, and Maimonides did not list it as one of the Thirteen Principles of the Jewish Faith.

            The "Chosen People" idea is so powerful that other religious sects have appropriated it. Both Catholicism and Protestantism believe that God chose the Jews, but that two thousand years ago a new covenant was made with Christianity. During most of Christian history, and even among some adherents to the present day, Christian chosenness meant that only Christians go to heaven while the nonchosen are either placed in limbo or are damned.

            Mohammed, likewise, didn't deny Abraham's chosenness. He simply claimed that Abraham was a Muslim, and he traced Islam's descent through the Jewish Patriarch.

            Source: Much of this article was reprinted with permission from Joseph Telushkin. Jewish Literacy. NY: William Morrow and Co., 1991.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 5:01 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Rob123 posted at 4:08 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013

            The obvious flaw in that attempted refutation is that the experiment cited merely showed that it was possible for a catalytic reaction to promote and sustain itself while randomly producing elaborate polymeric chains, some of which were catalytically reactive and others which weren't. The experiment never produced a living cell nor anything even remotely qualified to be called "life."

            In fact, it was essentially an organic version of a similar process that occurs in all stars, where fusion reactions produce more complex atoms which are then fused into even heavier atoms until the star finally collapses on itself and cannot sustain the process any longer.

            To accept this experiment as "proof" that life created itself by a sequence of chance combinations of amino acids requires that one define "life" as nothing more than a self-promoting series of chemical reactions. Per that definition, every star in the universe is alive.

            As for the "garbage bag" model of cellular life, that is mere conjecture and one which has been rejected by most molecular biologists who actually understand the vast complexity of a living cell. Theories always look more feasible when there's so much that you don't know and, for a theoretical physicist, there's SO much about molecular biology that he doesn't know.

            Let me be clear that I have no dog in this fight. I'm an agnostic and I'm not trying to prove or disprove the existence of a creator. I just have an honest desire to know where all this came from and why, free from the biases which often drive others to argue wrongly that science has already settled the matter.

             
          • Rob123 posted at 4:56 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            HighTechCowboy posted at 4:35 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            [tongue]

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_XCVnV5CGh0

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 4:35 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Bronco: I've been here three times longer than you but you've posted twice as many comments. Yap-yap-yap-yap...

            HTC: No surprises there. I know a he// of a lot more than you and therefore have more to share with others.

            Maybe if you spent less time on the beach and more time reading about the important issues in life, you'd have something of value to offer as well.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 4:33 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Biden and Obama are supposedly talking to everyone interested in the "gun control" debate triggered by the Newtown shooting. They insist that they haven't decided what strategies to pursue; but, being the idiot progressives that they are, they don't realize that they've given themselves away by referring to this as a "gun control" debate.

            If they really wanted to protect our children and the general public for that matter, they'd be calling this a "violence prevention" debate, but that's not how they've couched it. It's quite clear that they're after law-abiding citizens' Second Amendment rights and aren't even addressing the violence prevention issue.

            How like a progressive to always be having the wrong discussion.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 4:15 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            HighTechCowboy posted at 3:34 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013

            HTC-"Modern microbiology has exposed an incredible complexity to even the simplest cell and we've still barely scratched the surface in our understanding of the subject. But let's start small and calculate the probability that a simple necessary 300 nucleotide long ribozyme might create itself by the chance combination of the 4 amino acids in the right sequence. The chance of that happening is 1 in 4 to the 300th power, a number so large that it is unlikely to happen even once in the 13 billion years that our universe as been around, much less the 4 billion that the earth has existed."

            http://www.sciencenews.org/view/feature/id/340401/description/Traces_of_Inaugural_Life

            Traces of Inaugural Life
            Geologists, biologists join forces to tell new stories about the first cells on Earth

            IABD- As you stated before, you were almost a medical doctor and almost a doctor of engineering. Why dost thou profess so much with a lack of valid critical reasoning skills in science or politics?

             
          • Rob123 posted at 4:08 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            HTC: "But let's start small and calculate the probability that a simple necessary 300 nucleotide long ribozyme might create itself by the chance combination of the 4 amino acids in the right sequence. The chance of that happening is 1 in 4 to the 300th power, a number so large that it is unlikely to happen"

            http://www.science20.com/stars_planets_life/calculating_odds_life_could_begin_chance

            Calculating The Odds That Life Could Begin By Chance

            Many people, perhaps most, hate the idea that life might depend on chance processes. It is a human tendency to search for meaning, and what could be more meaningful than the belief that our lives have a greater purpose, that all life in fact is guided by a supreme intelligence which manifests itself even at the level of individual molecules?

            Proponents of intelligent design believe that the components of life are so complex that they could not possibly have been produced by an evolutionary process. To bolster their argument, they calculate the odds that a specific protein might assemble by chance in the prebiotic environment. The odds against such a chance assembly are so astronomically immense that a protein required for life to begin could not possibly have assembled by chance on the early Earth. Therefore, the argument goes, life must have been designed.


            It is not my purpose to argue against this belief, but the intelligent design argument uses a statistical tool of science -- a probability calculation -- to make a point, so I will use another tool of science, which is to propose an alternative hypothesis and test it. In living cells, most catalysts are protein enzymes, composed of amino acids, but in the 1980s another kind of catalyst was discovered. These are RNA molecules composed of nucleotides that are now called ribozymes. Because a ribozyme can act both as a catalyst and as a carrier of genetic information in its nucleotide sequence, it has been proposed that life passed through an RNA World phase that did not require DNA and proteins.

            For the purposes of today’s column I will go through the probability calculation that a specific ribozyme might assemble by chance. Assume that the ribozyme is 300 nucleotides long, and that at each position there could be any of four nucleotides present. The chances of that ribozyme assembling are then 4^300, a number so large that it could not possibly happen by chance even once in 13 billion years, the age of the universe.

            But life DID begin! Could we be missing something?

            The answer, of course, is yes, we are. The calculation assumes that a single specific ribozyme must be synthesized for life to begin, but that’s not how it works. Instead, let’s make the plausible assumption that an enormous number of random polymers are synthesized, which are then subject to selection and evolution. This is the alternative hypothesis, and we can test it.


            Now I will recall a classic experiment by David Bartel and Jack Szostak, published in Science in 1993. Their goal was to see if a completely random system of molecules could undergo selection in such a way that defined species of molecules emerged with specific properties. They began by synthesizing many trillions of different RNA molecules about 300 nucleotides long, but the nucleotides were all random nucleotide sequences. Nucleotides, by the way, are monomers of the nucleic acids DNA and RNA, just as amino acids are the monomers, or subunits, of proteins, and making random sequences is easy to do with modern methods of molecular biology.

            They reasoned that buried in those trillions were a few catalytic RNA molecules called ribozymes that happened to catalyze a ligation reaction, in which one strand of RNA is linked to a second strand. The RNA strands to be ligated were attached to small beads on a column, then were exposed to the trillions of random sequences simply by flushing them through the column. This process could fish out any RNA molecules that happened to have even a weak ability to catalyze the reaction. They then amplified those molecules and put them back in for a second round, repeating the process for 10 rounds. By the way, this is the same basic logic that breeders use when they select for a property such as coat color in dogs.


            The results were amazing. After only 4 rounds of selection and amplification they began to see an increase in catalytic activity, and after 10 rounds the rate was 7 million times faster than the uncatalyzed rate. It was even possible to watch the RNA evolve. Nucleic acids can be separated and visualized by a technique called gel electrophoresis. The mixture is put in at the top of a gel held between two glass plates and a voltage is applied. Small molecules travel fastest through the gel, and larger molecules move more slowly, so they are separated. In this case, RNA molecules having a specific length produce a visible band in a gel. At the start of the reaction, nothing could be seen, because all the molecules are different. But with each cycle new bands appeared. Some came to dominate the reaction, while others went extinct.


            Bartel and Szostak’s results have been repeated and extended by other researchers, and they demonstrate a fundamental principle of evolution at the molecular level. At the start of the experiment, every molecule of RNA was different from all the rest because they were assembled by a chance process. There were no species, just a mixture of trillions of different molecules. But then a selective hurdle was imposed, a ligation reaction that allowed only certain molecules to survive and reproduce enzymatically.

            In a few generations groups of molecules began to emerge that displayed ever-increasing catalytic function. In other words, species of molecules appeared out of this random mixture in an evolutionary process that closely reflects the natural selection that Darwin outlined for populations of higher animals. These RNA molecules were defined by the sequence of bases in their structures, which caused them to fold into specific conformations that had catalytic properties. The sequences were in essence analogous to genes, because the information they contained was passed between generations during the amplification process.


            The Bartel and Szostak experiment directly refutes the argument that the odds are stacked against an origin of life by natural processes. The inescapable conclusion is that genetic information can in fact emerge from random mixtures of polymers, as long as the populations contain large numbers of polymeric molecules with variable monomer sequences, and a way to select and amplify a specific property.


            I will close with a quote from Freeman Dyson, a theoretical physicist at Princeton University who also enjoys thinking about the origin of life:


            “You had what I call the garbage bag model. The early cells were just little bags of some kind of cell membrane, which might have been oily or it might have been a metal oxide. And inside you had a more or less random collection of organic molecules, with the characteristic that small molecules could diffuse in through the membrane, but big molecules could not diffuse out. By converting small molecules into big molecules, you could concentrate the organic contents on the inside, so the cells would become more concentrated and the chemistry would gradually become more efficient. So these things could evolve without any kind of replication. It's a simple statistical inheritance. When a cell became so big that it got cut in half, or shaken in half, by some rainstorm or environmental disturbance, it would then produce two cells which would be its daughters, which would inherit, more or less, but only statistically, the chemical machinery inside. Evolution could work under those conditions.”

            www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151179151557234&set=a.186355312233.139593.83715487233&type=1&theater

             
          • Pete posted at 3:39 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            fredh posted at 3:05 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013

            [ohmy]

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 3:38 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            fredh posted at 3:05 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013

            fredh-"Women's Role
            Women weren't made to be passionate sex partners. There mission in life
            is to be mothers,which also means custodian of morality, and music,
            religion, and culture."

            IABD- Don't forget a woman's role is also baking brownies and cookies for the men at the JBS meetings. :)

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 3:34 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Rob123: You're such a politician, sometimes, always stroking your base. Enlighten Up!

            HTC: You're quite the comedian. You call mathematics "politics" but combine the word "politics" with "science", creating the ultimate oxymoron.

            Modern microbiology has exposed an incredible complexity to even the simplest cell and we've still barely scratched the surface in our understanding of the subject. But let's start small and calculate the probability that a simple necessary 300 nucleotide long ribozyme might create itself by the chance combination of the 4 amino acids in the right sequence. The chance of that happening is 1 in 4 to the 300th power, a number so large that it is unlikely to happen even once in the 13 billion years that our universe as been around, much less the 4 billion that the earth has existed.

            Then compound the problem with the chance creation and proximity of the other necessary-for-life nucleotide chains and their chance arrangement into the various components and organelles of a simple cell and you have an astronomically big number suggesting that it simply couldn't and didn't happen that way.

             
          • fredh posted at 3:05 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            fredh Posts: 100

            Women's Role
            Women weren't made to be passionate sex partners. There mission in life
            is to be mothers,which also means custodian of morality, and music,
            religion, and culture.
            That's why the Almighty endowed them with just erotic fervor to want a
            husband, but with a greater urged to care for children, and engage in
            nest building.
            Old Mexican proverb; A house does not rest on the grown, it rest on a women.
            Since mothers started staying in the workforce 1972 because government told women you are to valuable to stay home and raise your children, we the government will raise and brain wash your children. Government has passed over 400 laws to empower women since 1964 to 2011. Laws like affirmative action and quotas . A women career and her vehicle are more important then being a mother. The Bible says you can not serve two masters. Women now out number men in Americas workforce. The roll given to women by God , is the most important part of the family.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 2:56 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            Pete posted at 2:37 pm on Wed, Jan 9,2013

            "Which is crazier in the end? Saying you are willing to defend your constitutional rights or claiming that constitutional rights need to be done away with?"

            IABD- Perhaps admitting that anything you think, may and will be used against you. :)

             
          • Pete posted at 2:37 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            Rob123 posted at 9:30 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013

            "But old Alex was right there on Prime Time, making a complete Azz of himself. Sad........"

            I don't want to belabor the point, because we probably agree more than disagree on this (despite ourselves) , but Morgan makes an azz of himself nearly every night on prime time and none more so than when he chooses to speak of our fundamental rights as if they should be subject to opinion polls of the moment .

            Which is crazier in the end? Saying you are willing to defend your constitutional rights or claiming that constitutional rights need to be done away with? It seems we are now at the point where the elimination or limitation of constitutional rights has become a viable political strategy of the left and they seem immune to any criticism on the matter under the age-old guise of "the end justifies the means"....and that is sad.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 2:31 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            kohanna- Beyond atheism and beyond agnosticism have you taken this survey?

            Attitudes of Educated Orthodox Jews Toward Science - a survey

            by Alexander Nussbaum
            http://www.secularhumanism.org/index.php?section=library&page=nussbaum_fi_30_1

             
          • kohana posted at 1:32 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            No you don't Rob, or you are being deliberately obtuse. The Jews have always been the locals in Israel and Jerusalem, with a few Arab tribes who lived in dirt villages. The current Arabs and other locals are of Islam who declare on a daily basis their plans to destroy every Jew in the world, down to the last one. They are really p.i.s.s.e.d. they haven't been able to accomplish this as yet. Those in Gaza and the PLO have it in their charters, to destroy Israel and you know it.

            Being of the Chosen Tribe, put tremendous obligations on a person. Maybe you should study some more of what those obligations are.

            Oh, and ask any Arab or so called Palestinian who happens to hold Israeli citizenship if they want to give it up and move to Gaza, or Syria, or Jordan, or Lebanon or Egypt.

             
          • Rob123 posted at 12:40 pm on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            kohana: ".....you seem not to grasp it,....."

            Oh, I grasp it. I do, however, have a problem with Archaeologists using the Old Testament as a modern day Clerk and Recorders Office, and wondering why all the locals are so mad. Incredible? Or the burden of being the Chosen Tribe?

             
          • kohana posted at 11:31 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            Rob123 posted at 9:49 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013

            You don't seem to be paying attention to what I am saying. The slug in your story blew himself up, and it was righteous justice. I think the trash in OUR White House is poisonous fungus and don't approve of anything he does, especially the drone attacks against American citizens, putting him above the law.

            The rest of your statement is in error, and since I have already in prior months explained Israeli history to you and you seem not to grasp it, or rather, you prefer to discount it, there is no point in repeating myself.

             
          • laker1 posted at 11:22 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            laker1 Posts: 112

            Bronco,

            You may wish to go to http://www.randomhouse.com/pantheon/authors/goldstein/ and select 36 Arguments on the navigation bar. I must warn you that doing so will endanger your immortal soul.

            Far better to understand that the Deus got his B.S. degree in E.E. from M.I.T. and designed the Universe to be comply completely with IEEE standards.

             
          • Bronco posted at 10:39 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            HTC: I'm sure they mean something to him but they're meaningless to me; after all, in spite of his education and his awards, he voted for Obama TWICE.
            -----------------
            I would say that, like me, he DIDN'T vote for Rmoney. Which makes both of us smarter than you.

            And by small-dog complex, I wasn't referring to physical size. You attack my posts even when you agree with them, defending some king-of-the-hill notion you think is important. Grrr, yap-yap.

            I've been here three times longer than you but you've posted twice as many comments. Yap-yap-yap-yap...

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 10:32 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            Mr. H, Thank you for displaying your compassionate right-wing bedside manner and political alliance with Ted Nugent of the NRA to the readers. The statistical correlations studies to be analyzed by your past NRA instructional influence upon young gun owners locally may determine whether or not the "Eddie Eagle" gun safety course for pre-schoolers has produced a far superior future bumper crop of youth ready to shoot anyone driving in the far left lane. Oh yes, GAWD bless America!

             
          • Rob123 posted at 10:09 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            HighTechCowboy posted at 9:47 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            You're such a politician, sometimes, always stroking your base. Enlighten Up!

             
          • kohana posted at 10:08 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            It's absolutely beyond me why anyone would pay to watch this piece of slime strut down the street in a parade. Same with a ball, packed to the rafters with people who "pay" to access of the room. All his fair weather friends who "pay" to be near him. Enough to make a person up-chuck.

            When I was much younger, I had a very good friend who was friends with the Switz Ambassador to the US, and I received a gold embossed invitation to meet with the Ambassador at a reception and dance. No money crossed anyone's palm and those kind of invites are honorable.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 9:53 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Rob123 posted at 3:02 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            If gun control will keep the bad guys from getting guns, let's ban heroin and meth, too!

            Oh, wait,..we've been trying that for over 40 years and they're cheaper and more available than ever.

             
          • Rob123 posted at 9:49 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            kohona: "I have zero tolerance for anyone who cannot control their physical urges. Sorry you were the one to clean up the mess, however, he got absolutely what he deserved, and was blown to hell, or hopefully something similar thereof."

            Hummmmm.....so you do understand President Obama's Drone Policy? I don't. I think holding up the Values of a Republic based on Law are quite important.......Even for 'Chosen' Tribes trying to reclaim their ancestral home after a 1000+ years. Or anybody else, for that matter.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 9:47 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Rob123: There is life out there, and you know it. Do the math!

            HTC: It is precisely because those who excel at such calculations have concluded that it was massively IMPROBABLE that life invented itself on this, the most life-accomodating planet we know of, that I am forced to reject your hypothesis.

            The math simply doen't support your conclusion.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 9:43 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            I'd love to hear our resident Obama supporters' rationalizations excusing Obama for this major hypocritical turnabout:

            Million Dollar Corporate Donations Sought for Obama Inauguration
            January 9, 2013 | AP

            Washington – Planners of President Barack Obama's second inauguration are soliciting high-dollar contributions up to $1 million to help pay for the celebration in exchange for special access.

            The changes are part of a continuing erosion of Obama's pledge to keep donors and special interests at arm's length of his presidency. He has abandoned the policy from his first inauguration to accept donations up to only $50,000 from individuals, announcing last month that he would take unlimited contributions from individuals and corporations.

            A fundraising appeal obtained by The Associated Press shows the Presidential Inaugural Committee is going far beyond Obama's previous self-imposed limits and is looking to blow away modern American presidential inauguration fundraising records by offering donors four VIP packages named after the country's founding fathers.

            Event organizers are hoping the packages will pay for expensive events surrounding Obama's inaugural on Jan. 21. Obama raised $53 million in private money for his first inauguration, when a record 1.8 million people packed the National Mall to see the nation's first black president take the oath of office. The celebration has been scaled down this year, with less than half the crowd expected and a cut from 10 inauguration-night bal|s to two.

            But the pressure is high to pay for the festivities after donors already contributed to the most expensive political race in U.S. history, a campaign that exceeded $2 billion. So far, health care executives and major Democratic Party donors -- including those who've taken private meetings with Obama or his senior staff -- are among those paying for the party.

            The shifts underscore Obama's evolving stance on changing how business is conducted in Washington. He criticized pay-for-access privileges during his first campaign, and after coming into office he pledged to have the most transparent administration in history. The president once shunned lobbyists but later gave some waivers to work for his administration. Once a vocal opponent of super political action committees -- which can spend as much money as they can raise to help candidates -- Obama later embraced them when faced with the mountain of cash spent by allies of his Republican campaign challengers.

            The inaugural donation pitch for top contributors promotes a standard inaugural fundraising practice of offering packages that include tickets to bal|s and other events, albeit at much higher prices this time.

            Donors at the "Washington" level are offered "premium partner access" for a minimum donation of $250,000 from individuals and $1 million from corporations. The package includes four tickets to the inaugural bal|, an in-demand perk with just two being held this year on inauguration night. Inaugural planners also offered $60 tickets for members of the general public, but they sold out quickly Sunday night. Tickets to the Commander In Chiefs Bal| are free for invited members of the military and other guests.

            Other perks of the Washington package include two bleacher seats to the parade, a VIP reception at a Candle Light Celebration on inauguration eve, tickets to a children's concert, co-chairs reception and a "Road Ahead" meeting featuring members of the president's finance team Saturday and tickets to a benefactors' reception to kick off the weekend.

            The "Adams" package also promises premium partner access for $150,000 from individuals and $500,000 from corporations. It offers two tickets to the bal| but not the parade bleacher seats and some other reception access.

            Donors are offered "special partner access" that still includes bal| tickets and the Candle Light Celebration at the National Building Museum for donations of $75,000 for individuals and $250,000 for corporations at the "Jefferson" level and $10,000 and $100,000 at the "Madison" level.

            Presidential Inaugural Committee officials point out that many civic organizations also accept corporate donations and that they do not allow sponsorship deals. The committee also says it vets donations and rejects those from companies that haven't paid back loans from the 2008 federal bailout of Wall Street. And it does not accept donations from any foreign entity in compliance with federal law.

            "Our guidelines aren't just consistent with the law -- they are consistent with the president's commitment to transparency and to reducing the influence of PACs and lobbyists in Washington," the committee said in a statement. "In fact, President Obama is the only president who has refused to accept donations from PACs and lobbyists for his inaugural committee and put in place the most robust disclosures for his inaugural committees, which include regularly posting donors to a website."

            More than 400 individuals and a handful of corporations have so far contributed $200 or more to the committee, according to the online list. The rolling disclosure goes beyond the law that requires that donations be disclosed within 90 days of the inauguration.

            But the list of donors being posted online is limited. It contains only names of people and companies who contributed, and offers no information on how much each donor gave. There is also no hint at the donors' occupations or where they're from.

            An AP review of those names, combined with government records and White House visitor logs, found more than 30 inauguration benefactors who apparently have had private meetings with Obama's advisers, dined at state dinners or attended holiday parties with the president in attendance.

            Donors to the 2013 inaugural party include Bertram Scott and Challis Lowe, two health care executives who've been to 1600 Pennsylvania Ave., records show. Scott, a former president with Cigna, and Lowe, Ascension Health's senior vice president for organizational development and human resources, attended White House receptions.

            Beyond health care circles, inaugural supporters include David DesJardins, a former Google top staffer and political activist who met with deputy national security adviser Denis McDonough in March 2010. DesJardins contributed more than $100,000 in the recent election campaign to American Bridge 21st Century, a super PAC supporting Obama's a second term.

            Irwin Jacobs, co-founder of tech giant Qualcomm and one of the biggest donors to Obama's re-election effort, also is among the inauguration donors. The La Jolla, Calif., billionaire has given more than $2 million to pro-Obama super PACs and thousands more directly to Obama's campaign and the Democrats.

            An aide said Jacobs was out of the country and unavailable for comment. None of the other donors responded Tuesday to requests for comment.

            Not all the donors have gotten what they wanted from Obama in his first term. For instance, AT&T has faced regulatory hurdles, including its decision to scuttle a merger with T-Mobile USA at a cost of $4 billion following opposition from the Obama administration. Microsoft donated even though Obama opposed an immigration bill that the company supported to expand visas for its workers.

            The $1 million donations sought by Obama's inaugural committee far surpass the record $250,000-range in contributions made by corporations and affluent financiers during the inaugurations of George W. Bush and Bill Clinton, and appear to the be the highest in the history of American presidential inaugurations, several inauguration analysts say.

            The Federal Election Commission allows limitless contributions to presidential inaugurations, but recent presidents set self-imposed bars. Bush set a limit of $250,000 on inaugural contributions for his 2005 event and $100,000 for his 2001 event. Those caps did little to damp the flow from corporate contributors, as Bush reaped $42.5 million in inaugural donations in 2005 and $30 million in 2001. Despite the limits, several firms gave as much as $750,000 apiece by donating from corporate subsidiaries.

            Clinton's inaugural committee raised $23 million for his 1997 event, adding to a $9 million surplus left over from nearly $30 million in fundraising for his 1993 inauguration. In 1993, Clinton's inaugural committee tried to sell $1 million corporate sponsorships to fund a televised gala, but didn't get any takers, with the highest cash donations at $250,000 and a contribution of $1.5 million worth of communications equipment from Motorola. Clinton set a much tighter cap for his second inaugural, limiting contributions to $100 and selling bal| tickets for a maximum of $3,000 each.

             
          • Rob123 posted at 9:30 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            Pete posted at 8:44 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            If one digs a little, one can find nut cases all over the internet and supporting or not supporting any position. But old Alex was right there on Prime Time, making a complete Azz of himself. Sad.........

             
          • Rob123 posted at 9:27 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            HighTechCowboy posted at 8:09 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            There is life out there, and you know it. Do the math! [smile]

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 9:20 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            The Psychology behind mass shootings.
            Peter Michaelson, an author and experienced psychotherapist in Ann Arbor, Michigan.

            While some mass shooters are psychotic or schizophrenic, only about five percent of violence in the United States can be attributed to people with mental illness. The shooters are often men who are not so visibly disturbed. These murderers lived next door to neighbors who never imagined them capable of such crimes.

            We prefer to believe that the behavior of the shooters is foreign to human nature, not something intrinsic in our psyche. Or we say that a gun-worshipping culture is to blame. Yet might there be another factor, some common element at the heart of human nature, to account in part for these horrendous events?

            We all have a dark side. Psychology, literature, and mythology have chronicled this aspect of our nature, yet still we flee from examining it. Carl Jung wrote in his 1957 classic, The Undiscovered Self, that a true understanding of the inner self recognizes the existence of good and evil within us. In his view, the unconscious was being ignored “out of downright resistance to the mere possibility of there being a second psychic authority besides the ego. It seems a positive menace to the ego that its monarchy can be doubted.” Jung also wrote that a lack of insight deprives us of the capacity to deal with evil. Underestimation of the psychological factor, he added, “is likely to take a bitter revenge.”

            Looking for dynamics in our psyche that we might have in common with mass shooters is a delicate subject. We keep our distance as if they belong to a different species. Yet these shootings have been occurring for many years now and could become more frequent. We have to consider possible answers that lie closer to home.

            Let’s start by examining a profile that fits many mass shooters. These murderers are often quite intelligent, yet through acute self-centeredness they are likely to be socially awkward or inept. They crave notice and fame to compensate for how deeply they dismiss their own value and feel like nobodies. They also lack empathy and have little or no affect, a condition that relates to the indifference or disdain they have for their own existence.

            Negative emotions accumulate inside them, producing bitterness, anger, despair, and, finally, rage. Their rage, even when hidden from others, produces a third-rate sense of power that covers up their emotional entanglement in hopelessness and passivity. They crave power because they feel so powerless, yet in their dark negativity they can express only negative, destructive power. They seek death because they feel so powerfully overwhelmed by life.

            Because their weak self-regulation compels them to continually recycle negative emotions, they hold on to grudges. These grudges and grievances accumulate in them, giving them a feeling of substance, a place of being to which they cling in the chaos of their inner conflict.
            The killer-to-be has also passively allowed himself to plunge so deeply into self-abandonment and self-hatred—meaning his aggressive rejection of all that is good or decent in him—that, like a drowning person, he gasps for the one last “breath” of the only power now available to him, which is to do evil.

            An additional factor shapes these menacing time-bombs. These killers-to-be have acquired a fervent interest in guns. Influenced by others, they passively elevate the gun or the rifle to level of a fetish. In another time and place, they’re the kind of people who might have joined a cult. For a troubled individual who is drowning in negativity, to adore guns is to worship death.

            From this we can assume that the murderous instincts of rampage shooters originate from profound inner weakness and emotional conflict in their psyche. Their aggression, in part, is based on their reaction to their overflowing negative emotions and their resulting lack of self-regulation. By way of comparison, many everyday people have considerable deposits of anger, cynicism, and bitterness. They hold on to this negativity for dear life. Convinced that their bitterness is justified by the alleged cruelty or insensitivity of others, they express various levels of malice toward others. Is the difference between rampage shooters and the rest of us just a matter of degree?

            To heed Jung’s warning, we must grow our consciousness. This inner progress would enable parents, teachers, clergy, and others to become more insightful about the emotional state of others and more confident about initiating some form of intervention. As well, potential killers will likely moderate their deadly instincts when they are surrounded by more conscious people, exposed to better psychological knowledge, and made through saner weapons regulation to understand that the death instinct, easily spawned where weapons are sanctified, is a social taboo.

            Reform may require that more of us access, at least on paper, the best information concerning the dynamics of emotional conflict. How many people understand, for instance, that during preparations for their assaults, killers-to-be become fixated on images of their helpless, desperate victims, as they identify masochistically with the helpless despair they feel so strongly in themselves? Vital knowledge about human nature can permeate the culture, raising the collective consciousness. When disseminated in the media, the knowledge seeps into the minds of even the least intellectually inclined.

            What are some essentials of this knowledge? We have to learn that our negative impressions, impulses, and emotions are not caused exclusively by external factors, even when life is difficult and seems unfair. Unconsciously, we prefer to believe that our hurt, anger, and rage are produced by the oversights and malice of others. This irrational belief stems from our unconscious attempt to cover up our participation in our suffering. When people begin to understand how they produce their own suffering, they stop projecting on to others (and experiencing by way of transference from others) the negativity churned up by their own unresolved emotions. Now they no longer despise others or see them as the enemy.

            As long as people go on believing that their suffering is caused by others, they’ll be compelled to become angry at others because they’re required, through their unconscious defenses, to blame others for allegedly bullying, punishing, oppressing, or persecuting them. In ongoing stubborn denial of their participation in their suffering and failure, some take their anger to the next level and begin to generate rage toward their alleged victimizers.

            Once we understand this basic concept—that our suffering is produced through inner conflict—we have nowhere to turn for relief but inward. Parents need to learn this so they represent this truth in their dealings with both normal and troubled children. Liberation from pain and suffering is the next great expansion of our freedoms.

            Once we turn our intelligence inward, we come across two great insights. The first involves our understanding of the roles played in our psyche between aggression and passivity. (Read, “Our Messy Mix of Aggression and Passivity.”) These two aspects of our psyche are in conflict with each other; the more dysfunctional or neurotic we are, the more intense the conflict is likely to be. Typically, people are aware of the painful symptoms of the conflict but not the conflict itself.

            Second, we’re inclined to recycle and replay, no matter how painful, whatever negative emotions are unresolved in our psyche. (Read, “Why Our Emotional Suffering Persists.”) Inner passivity, a kind of existential self-doubt with which many of us identify, is one of these negative emotions. It causes troubled individuals to feel that aggression, including extravagant displays of it, is their only recourse.

            Learning this knowledge makes us wiser and more astute. The troubled people who cross our path are also helped in unseen ways by our evolved nature.

            http://www.whywesuffer.com/the-psychology-behind-mass-shootings/

            IABD- Mr. H, The lines of your treble cleff should not be referred as: "Every Good Boy Deserves Fireams. You insult everybody's intelligence.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 9:19 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Those nutjobs in CA have offered up their "mental health" program as a model for Biden to take nationally:

            http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/01/09/use-california-as-mental-health-model-that-crazy-says-lawmaker/

             
          • Pete posted at 8:48 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            HTC: "Alex Jones is no worse than the nutjobs I've heard on Air America or Al Gore's channel which he just sold."

            I don't see Barry distancing himself from MSNBC''s nut job Al Sharpton....he// no...he's "consulting" with him on the budget.

             
          • Pete posted at 8:44 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            Rob123 posted at 7:59 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013

            I'm not sure Jone's would appreciate being called "right wing" and I'm not sure many "right winger's" would appreciate it either, but I'll let them argue that. I do agree he's certainly not the most effective advocate of the second amendment, but if he "screwed up" the message, then how do you characterize folks who advocated shooting him? Sounds pretty "extreme" to me. Or are they granted rhetorical license because they are obviously well-intentioned liberals?

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 8:22 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            mooseberryinn: Many insurance companies are trimming benefits, and raising premiums to absorb the costs of...(you guessed it)..."Obama/Demo-care"

            HTC: Many insurance companies are requesting massive rate increases because of the fact that they have to begin the process of seeking such approval now, even though the feds are WAY behind in drafting all the regulations which will affect them come January 1, 2014. The average increase requested is around 20%.

            Regardless of what the actual increases turn out to be, one fact remains perfectly clear: health insurance costs are going to be going up much more than what has been their historical rate of increase and all because of ObamaCare. So, the Unaffordable Care Act is making health insurance even more unaffordable to Americans AND it will now punish (tax) them for their failure to buy what they previously could barely afford.

            Only an idiot who voted for Obama would think that's a good deal, but they can console themselves with the meaningless fact that Obama has recently changed his position (being the chameleon he is) and has publicly supported gay marriage. I'm sure that will help to take the sting out of the ObamaCare fine, er, tax.

            Most of the idiots I know who voted for Obama this second time around have said something like: "I voted for free contraception/abortion and gay marriage rights. Obama supports these individual rights." (Of course, most of their 'rights' are nowhere to be found in the Constitution.)

            Yeah, and he also supports collectively taking our economy, job creation and the documented Constitutional rights of others (such as the right to free exercise of religion) right down the crapper.

            Such 'logic' indicates a seriously critical-thinking and judgment-impaired mind.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 8:09 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Rob123: http://www.universetoday.com/99309/nearly-all-sun-like-stars-have-planetary-systems/

            HTC: But so far they've had no luck identifying any that could support life as we know it. The search for such planets has only reinforced our world's uniqueness.

             
          • kohana posted at 8:07 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            Rob123 posted at 3:02 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013

            I have zero tolerance for anyone who cannot control their physical urges. Sorry you were the one to clean up the mess, however, he got absolutely what he deserved, and was blown to hell, or hopefully something similar thereof. I don’t understand how you equate a young boy saving a girl from being raped and shot for his efforts, with your experience of cleaning up what was left of a piece of puke.


            Bronco posted at 12:02 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013

            You are truly clueless saying HTC has "a small-dog complex..." because you do not know, and have never met HTC.


             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 8:07 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Rob123: http://www.upworthy.com/angry-gun-advocate-loses-it-live-on-cnn-in-the-most-bizarre-interview-ever?c=ufb1

            HTC: Alex Jones is no worse than the nutjobs I've heard on Air America or Al Gore's channel which he just sold.

            They exist at both ends of the spectrum.

             
          • Rob123 posted at 8:02 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            Pete posted at 7:38 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            I remember reading about the Moon Landing in Stars and Stripes, Far East Edition, while sitting on a crapper by the Cambodian Border.......[wink]

             
          • Rob123 posted at 7:59 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            Pete posted at 7:23 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            I know, and do not agree, with Piers Morgan's Euro-style gun control. But Alex Jones is sooooo typical of Right Wing Rhetorical Idiots who just screw the message up and are nothing but fools shooting themselves in the foot. And the National Polls are swinging towards Morgan's point of view.

             
          • mooseberryinn posted at 7:58 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            mooseberryinn Posts: 2697

            OK, there's no God in this one. Reign of Destruction # 2 for today. The EPA is dumping steaming piles of regulations upon the Power Generation failities of the U.S. This is causing loss of jobs, decrease in power available for industry and/ or higher energy prices. Way to go Dems! Given that the general effects of this are so predicable, one would think His Lordship, King and emperor, the all-powerful and all-knowing would have stopped action by his EPA. Nah, not on his agenda to "save" the country, only, "transform" it. (told ya so).

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 7:58 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Bronco: Selected awards and honors

            HTC: I'm sure they mean something to him but they're meaningless to me; after all, in spite of his education and his awards, he voted for Obama TWICE.

            What a waste of education!

            So in some regards, he's no smarter than you.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 7:56 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Bronco: [to kohana] Can you get any more full of yourself?

            HTC: If she used you as her role model, she'd realize that she's got a lot of catching up to do.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 7:54 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Bronco: That was Neil Tyson Degrasse you disagreed with. I simply posted the link.

            HTC: Then why did you get your panties all in a twist?

            I also found it interesting that he used genetic mutations and the horrible abnormalities they sometimes produce as an example of the imperfection which supposedly negates the theory of intelligent design. Apparently he forgot that random mutations is practically worshipped by evolutionary biologists as the reason for the abundance of species.

            One man's imperfection is another man's idea of brilliance.

             
          • Pete posted at 7:38 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            Rob123 posted at 4:28 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YFIngdF6ND0

             
          • Pete posted at 7:23 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            Rob123 posted at 3:02 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013

            Re: your Alex Jones/CNN link. This is what happened on Morgan's show after he (Alex Jones) left ...which proves Morgan was an mindless progressive hypocrite before Jones showed up and he was one after Jones left.

            PS. Jone's worldview is much different than my own...none-the-less, the double standard is incredible.

            "Piers Morgan and Guests Discuss Shooting Alex Jones"

            "Daily Beast writer Buzz Bissinger says Piers Morgan should “pop” Alex Jones with a semi-automatic
            weapon."

            http://www.infowars.com/veiled-threat-piers-morgan-guest-says-shoot-alex-jones/

             
          • mooseberryinn posted at 6:24 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            mooseberryinn Posts: 2697

            OK, so this falls under the heading; "Making room for Emperor Obama in a changing world". Jobs - Due to "Obama/Demo Care", companies are starting to limit employee hours moving toward part time jobs to avoid the costs of Health Care Insurance and/or the penalties imposed by "Obama/Demo-care". Same vein - small businesses are cutting jobs where possible to limit the number of employees to less than 50....(tah dah) to avoid the penalties imposed by (no surprise) "Obama/Demo-care". Many insurance companies are trimming benefits, and raising premiums to absorb the costs of...(you guessed it)..."Obama/Demo-care". Negative impact = continuing employment problems and slowing economc "recovery". So, the "Reign of Destruction" goes on under the watchfull eye of the Annointed One, Emperor, King, Comrade, Chairman, and or guru of "transformation" Obama. (told ya so).

             
          • Rob123 posted at 4:28 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            "Making room for God in a changing world"

            http://www.universetoday.com/99309/nearly-all-sun-like-stars-have-planetary-systems/

            "The latest analysis of data from the Kepler planet-hunting spacecraft reveals that almost all stars have planets, and about 17 percent of stars have an Earth-sized planet in an orbit closer than Mercury. Since the Milky Way has about 100 billion stars, there are at least 17 billion Earth-sized worlds out there, according to Francois Fressin of the Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics (CfA), who presented new findings today in a press conference at the American Astronomical Society meeting in Long Beach, California. Moreover, he said, almost all Sun-like stars have planetary systems.

            Read more: http://www.universetoday.com/99309/nearly-all-sun-like-stars-have-planetary-systems/#ixzz2HTb4SYaw

             
          • Rob123 posted at 3:02 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            kohana posted at 9:35 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.
            Posts: 1357
            "This is off topic, but I just found it and think it is important for folks to read and think about."

            hawwwwwww.........Ah, kohana, you haven't a clue! That made me laugh so hard I have to wipe the tears from my eyes.....

            But wait, no it didn't! Not really.....It did drag an old memory up, though. Sitting at my desk, in hot, sticky Vietnam one morning, when there was a large explosion in our barracks area....upon investigation, a noted azz-hole, racist American G.I. from the U of Georgia who had, at the rumor level, raped one or two momasons who cleaned our barracks and washed our clothes, had opened his locker and tripped a Claymore Mine and was unceremoniously blown through the opposite wall. Tough Justice? And since I was the 21 year old NCO living in the corner room of that barrack, it was my responsibility to clean up the mess and fix the hole in the wall. Almost needed a snow shovel, although from the hips down it was pretty much one piece. He was shipped home with a b.s. story, a purple heart, and instructions for a 'closed casket' ceremony.
            "This is off topic, but I just found it and think it is important for folks to read and think about."

            http://www.upworthy.com/angry-gun-advocate-loses-it-live-on-cnn-in-the-most-bizarre-interview-ever?c=ufb1

             
          • Bronco posted at 12:12 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            Oh...and he wrote a few books too...

            Selected books by Tyson

            Space Chronicles: Facing the Ultimate Frontier (2012)
            The Pluto Files: The Rise and Fall of America's Favorite Planet (2009)
            Death by Black Hole: And Other Cosmic Quandaries (2007)
            The Sky Is Not the Limit: Adventures of an Urban Astrophysicist (1st ed. 2000 / 2nd ed. 2004)
            Origins: Fourteen Billion Years of Cosmic Evolution (co-authored with Donald Goldsmith) (2004)
            My Favorite Universe (A twelve part lecture series) (2003)
            City of Stars: A New Yorker's Guide to the Cosmos (2002)
            Cosmic Horizons: Astronomy at the Cutting Edge (2000)
            One Universe: At Home in the Cosmos (2000)
            Just Visiting This Planet (1998)
            Universe Down to Earth (1994)
            Merlin's Tour of the Universe (1989)

             
          • Bronco posted at 12:09 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            in addition:

            Neil Tyson Degrasse

            Selected awards and honors

            Awards
            2001 Medal of Excellence, Columbia University, New York City
            2004 NASA Distinguished Public Service Medal
            2007 Klopsteg Memorial Award winner
            2009 Douglas S. Morrow Public Outreach Award from the Space Foundation for significant contributions to public awareness of space programs.
            2009 Isaac Asimov Award from the American Humanist Association
            [edit]Selected honorary doctorates
            1997 York College, City University of New York
            2000 Ramapo College, Mahwah, New Jersey
            2000 Dominican College, Orangeburg, New York
            2001 University of Richmond, Richmond, Virginia
            2002 Bloomfield College, Bloomfield, New Jersey
            2003 Northeastern University, Boston, Massachusetts
            2004 College of Staten Island, City University of New York
            2006 Pace University, New York City
            2007 Williams College, Williamstown, Massachusetts
            2007 Worcester Polytechnic Institute, Worcester, Massachusetts
            2008 University of Pennsylvania, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
            2010 University of Alabama in Huntsville, Huntsville, Alabama
            2010 Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Troy, New York
            2010 Eastern Connecticut State University, Willimantic, Connecticut
            2011 Gettysburg College, Gettysburg, Pennsylvania
            2012 Mount Holyoke College, South Hadley, Massachusetts
            2012 Western New England University, Springfield, Massachusetts
            2013 Lehigh University, Bethlehem, Pennsylvania
            Honors
            2000 Sexiest Astrophysicist Alive, People Magazine
            2001 asteroid named: 13123 Tyson, renamed from Asteroid 1994KA by the International Astronomical Union
            2001 The Tech 100, voted by editors of Crain's Magazine to be among the 100 most influential technology leaders in New York
            2004 Fifty Most Important African-Americans in Research Science
            2007 Harvard 100: Most Influential Harvard Alumni Magazine, Cambridge. Massachusetts
            2007 The Time 100, voted by the editors of Time Magazine as one of the 100 most influential people in the world
            2008 Discover Magazine selected him one of the "50 Best Brains in Science".

             
          • Bronco posted at 12:06 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            HTC: As for your post that I was responding to, if I agreed with you, we'd both be wrong.
            ------------------------------
            That was Neil Tyson Degrasse you disagreed with. I simply posted the link.

            Neil Tyson Degrasse
            Fields: Astrophysics, physical cosmology, science communication
            Institutions: Hayden Planetarium, PBS, Planetary Society
            Alma mater: Harvard University (AB)
            University of Texas at Austin (MA)
            Columbia University (MPhil, PhD)
            Influences Isaac Newton, Carl Sagan, Richard Feynman, Albert Einstein
            Notable awards NASA Distinguished Public Service Medal

             
          • Bronco posted at 12:02 am on Wed, Jan 9, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            kohana: Ah, Bronco, you haven't a clue!
            -------------------
            Wow. The clueless calling me clueless. Can you get any more full of yourself?

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 11:12 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            On January 4, New York Representative Jose Serrano introduced H.J. Res. 15 -- a resolution to repeal the 22nd Amendment and thereby abolish presidential term limits.

            H.J. Res. 15 is currently in the House Judiciary Committee, and lacks co-sponsors. In order to succeed, it must pass both the House and the Senate, and have support among at least 3/4 of the fifty state governments.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 10:53 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            kohana: "Those that self-identify as progressives, leftists, socialists or Marxists, have one overwhelming trait in common: they are narcissists who believe they are pre-ordained to rule the masses too ignorant to govern themselves."

            HTC: Indeed, and we're raising a bumper crop of them:

            We're Raising a Generation of Deluded Narcissists
            By Dr. Keith Ablow
            January 8, 2013

            A new analysis of the American Freshman Survey, which has accumulated data for the past 47 years from 9 million young adults, reveals that college students are more likely than ever to call themselves gifted and driven to succeed, even though their test scores and time spent studying are decreasing.

            Psychologist Jean Twenge, the lead author of the analysis, is also the author study showing that the tendency toward narcissism in students is up 30 percent in the last thirty-odd years.
            This data is not unexpected. I have been writing a great deal over the past few years about the toxic psychological impact of media and technology on children, adolescents and young adults, particularly as it regards turning them into faux celebrities—the equivalent of lead actors in their own fictionalized life stories.

            On Facebook, young people can fool themselves into thinking they have hundreds or thousands of “friends.” They can delete unflattering comments. They can block anyone who disagrees with them or pokes holes in their inflated self-esteem. They can choose to show the world only flattering, sexy or funny photographs of themselves (dozens of albums full, by the way), “speak” in pithy short posts and publicly connect to movie stars and professional athletes and musicians they “like.”

            We must beware of the toxic psychological impact of media and technology on children, adolescents and young adults, particularly as it regards turning them into faux celebrities—the equivalent of lead actors in their own fictionalized life stories.

            Using Twitter, young people can pretend they are worth “following,” as though they have real-life fans, when all that is really happening is the mutual fanning of false love and false fame.

            Using computer games, our sons and daughters can pretend they are Olympians, Formula 1 drivers, rock stars or sharpshooters. And while they can turn off their Wii and Xbox machines and remember they are really in dens and playrooms on side streets and in triple deckers around America, that is after their hearts have raced and heads have swelled with false pride for “being” something they are not.

            On MTV and other networks, young people can see lives just like theirs portrayed on reality TV shows fueled by such incredible self-involvement and self-love that any of the “real-life” characters should really be in psychotherapy to have any chance at anything like a normal life.

            These are the psychological drugs of the 21st Century and they are getting our sons and daughters very sick, indeed.

            As if to keep up with the unreality of media and technology, in a dizzying paroxysm of self-aggrandizing hype, town sports leagues across the country hand out ribbons and trophies to losing teams, schools inflate grades, energy drinks in giant, colorful cans take over the soft drink market, and psychiatrists hand out Adderall like candy.

            All the while, these adolescents, teens and young adults are watching a Congress that can’t control its manic, euphoric, narcissistic spending, a president that can’t see his way through to applauding genuine and extraordinary achievements in business, a society that blames mass killings on guns, not the psychotic people who wield them, and—here no surprise—a stock market that keeps rising and falling like a roller coaster as bubbles inflate and then, inevitably, burst.

            That’s really the unavoidable end, by the way. False pride can never be sustained. The bubble of narcissism is always at risk of bursting. That’s why young people are higher on drugs than ever, drunker than ever, smoking more, tattooed more, pierced more and having more and more and more sex, earlier and earlier and earlier, raising babies before they can do it well, because it makes them feel special, for a while. They’re doing anything to distract themselves from the fact that they feel empty inside and unworthy.

            Distractions, however, are temporary, and the truth is eternal. Watch for an epidemic of depression and suicidality, not to mention homicidality, as the real self-loathing and hatred of others that lies beneath all this narcissism rises to the surface. I see it happening and, no doubt, many of you do, too.

            We had better get a plan together to combat this greatest epidemic as it takes shape. Because it will dwarf the toll of any epidemic we have ever known. And it will be the hardest to defeat. Because, by the time we see the scope and destructiveness of this enemy clearly, we will also realize, as the saying goes, that it is us.

            Dr. Keith Ablow is a psychiatrist and member of the Fox News Medical A-Team. Dr. Ablow can be reached at info@keithablow.com.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 10:39 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Bronco: You certainly do have a small-dog complex. No wonder you have to lift your leg on every post of mine.

            HTC: So much for your commitment to engage in dialogue and avoid insult. Perhaps you think 'dialogue' is synonymous with agreement and disagreement equals "lifting your leg on it"?

            As for your post that I was responding to, if I agreed with you, we'd both be wrong.

             
          • kohana posted at 9:35 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            This is off topic, but I just found it and think it is important for folks to read and think about.

            January 8, 2013
            I Will Not Be Intimidated
            By Steve McCann

            As a young boy I was shot by a man whose clear intent was to kill me as I had deliberately, by throwing broken bricks at him, interrupted his attempt to rape a young teen-aged girl, allowing her to escape. To this day I can still see the evil in his face and the sun glistening off the barrel of the pistol he aimed in my direction. As I turned and began to run away he fired hitting me in back. The bullet entering my chest felt as if someone had hit me with baseball bat followed immediately by an excruciating burning sensation as I fell to the ground from the impact. Perhaps it was the adrenaline, but I was able scramble to my feet and run as far as I could until finally passing out from the shock and loss of blood. Fortunately, someone came to my rescue and took me to a military hospital and the first step on my journey to the United States.

            According to the current incarnation of the American left, who traffic constantly in victimhood and noble intentions, I should be in the vanguard of the mandatory gun control and confiscation movement. That somehow it was the inanimate object this soldier was holding and not him that was responsible for the attempt on my life or to ignore the fact that his mindset was such he would have used any weapon at hand to accomplish the same goal.

            On the contrary, I own a handgun today because of the experience of coming face to face with the evil that permeates some men's souls. I and the girl I rescued were defenseless. There were no police or armed citizens around and the death of another homeless and unknown boy and girl, buried in an unmarked mass grave, would have been just another easily ignored casualty of the post-War period. I was determined that I would never again face a similar circumstance. I have had in my possession firearms for virtually my entire life, as I have been fortunate to live in the one nation on earth that has embedded in its founding document the right to bear arms.

            Today, I am, along with a vast majority of my fellow citizens, being made the scapegoat for the failed policies of the so-called progressives -- whether it is the inability of society to deal with extreme psychopaths or the mentally deranged, because the left insists they are entitled to the same rights as other citizens, or the never-ending attempt to rehabilitate criminals incapable of rehabilitation. Consistent with their inability to ever admit a mistake, the left and much of the Democratic Party instead focuses on symbolism over substance and the path of least resistance -- going after the law-abiding hard working people who are the backbone of America.

            But the motivation is more insidious than that. Those that self-identify as progressives, leftists, socialists or Marxists, have one overwhelming trait in common: they are narcissists who believe they are pre-ordained to rule the masses too ignorant to govern themselves. Over the past thirty years as these extremists fully infiltrated academia, the mainstream media, the entertainment industry and taken over the Democratic Party, the American people have lost many of their individual rights. They are now being told what they can eat, where they can live, who they must associate with, where and how their children must be educated, and soon what medical care they are allowed to access, as well as the type of car they can drive and the amount of energy they are permitted to use.

            The last bastion of freedom is unfettered gun ownership, so that too must go. That the left is willfully and egregiously exploiting the actions of a deranged psychopath in the tragic death of 26 people (20 children) in Newtown, Connecticut to achieve this end exposes their true motivation.

            I immigrated to the United States from a continent that had nearly destroyed itself in World War II. The War was the end-product of the ascension to power of various ego-maniacs, steeped in socialist/Marxist ideology, determined to amass all political power within their countries. Once elected to office, these despots began to centralize their power and eliminate all individual freedoms and democratic institutions. The people, as they lived in nations that did not allow unfettered gun ownership, were powerless to stop the inexorable seizure of power and many paid the ultimate price as nearly 40+ million were killed during the War.

            Many on the left and others will say I am trafficking in hyperbole, that nothing similar to that could ever happen in the United States -- perhaps not a massive and physically destructive war but the destruction of the nation as it was founded is well on its way. These same ideologues have reassured the American people over the past 40 years that they had no intention of ever:

            Telling the American people how to live;
            Limiting access to medical care;
            Attempting by fiat and legislation to dramatically limit gun ownership;
            Shifting near unlimited power to Washington D.C., by ignoring the concept of federalism;
            Deliberately bankrupting the country;
            Placing the private sector under the thumb of bureaucrats;
            Monitoring without search warrants American's private conversations and communications;
            Allowing unrestrained illegal immigration in order to affect the voting patterns in their favor.

            Yet in the America of 2013 all this, and more, has come to past and we are expected to believe the progressive cabal when they say their ultimate aim is not to effectively invalidate the second amendment by ever more stringent laws and regulations.

            The left's fundamental objective of transforming America is in sight, particularly with a fellow-traveler in the White House no longer facing re-election. Over the next four years, this faction will push their agenda more forcefully than ever as they will never allow a crisis, real or manufactured; to go to waste as they make certain an ever-increasing percentage of the population becomes indentured to the government.

            I have lived my entire life on borrowed time and now in the twilight of my years, I have but one thing to say to those determined to take away or limit my right to own a firearm and to transform and destroy the greatest nation in the history of mankind. I, and many like me, will not be intimidated and you will only accomplish your ultimate ends over our dead bodies.

            Page Printed from: http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/../2013/01/i_will_not_be_intimidated.html at January 08, 2013

             
          • kohana posted at 9:08 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109


            Bronco posted at 6:27 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013
            You certainly do have a small-dog complex...

            hawwwwwww.........Ah, Bronco, you haven't a clue! That made me laugh so hard I have to wipe the tears from my eyes.....

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 7:31 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            Check out the similarity of Il Duce Mussolini's Fascist Party and the today's Tea Party movement.

            http://www.history.com/news/9-things-you-may-not-know-about-mussolini

             
          • Bronco posted at 6:27 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            HighTechCowboy posted at 4:39 pm
            -----------------
            You certainly do have a small-dog complex. No wonder you have to lift your leg on every post of mine.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 6:25 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            HighTechCowboy posted at 3:06 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013

            HTC: I quit doing business with BofA over 20 years ago because of a number of problems I had with them as well. The final straw was when one of their employees embezzled $25K from one of my accounts and they insisted that I must have withdrawn it and forgotten that I had. When I finally convinced them to look into it, they discovered that an employee had done it and hit several other customer accounts as well. She apparently made off with over $300K and had fled to South America.

            IABD: Why didn't you have the sense of putting your money in a real American Bank to begin with. BofA originally started out as the Bank of Italy in San Francisco in 1904 and still is BOI today. In 1930 during Italy's era of Fascist dictator Benito Mussolini, the new BofA facade was established. FYI:If your have any Wells Fargo accounts be aware WF is actually the Bank of England.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 5:32 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Debate about guns and safety calls for logic not emotion
            By Harry Wilson, Ph.D.
            January 8, 2013

            In the wake of tragedies we tend to react out of emotion. When dealing with policy-making, however, we all benefit if logic enters the discussion. It is difficult to imagine a more heart-wrenching event than the Newtown, Conn. shootings. The inevitable calls for more gun control legislation reflect an understandable desire to do something after 26 defenseless and innocent people are slaughtered.

            The more important question, however, is what can we do that will make a difference? That, I suggest, is the best way to honor those who lost their lives. Making us feel better should not be the measure. We should try to make a difference.

            That is exactly what those who advocate stricter gun control laws suggest will happen if we follow their advice. Whether it is re-enacting the assault weapons ban, limiting the capacity of magazines, closing the “gun-show loophole,” or requiring background checks for all private firearms sales, gun control advocates state with conviction that these measures will reduce future shootings. For the most part, they are wrong.

            The inevitable calls for more gun control legislation reflect an understandable desire to do something after 26 defenseless and innocent people are slaughtered. The more important question, however, is what can we do that will make a difference?

            Virtually all academic studies of the expired assault weapons ban, even those conducted by researchers who generally favor gun control, found the effect to be almost negligible. Given that the ban was based as much on appearance as functionality, and all existing guns were grandfathered, it would be illogical to think it would have been effective.

            There are between 2 million and 3 million AR-15-type firearms in the United States today. Prohibiting the manufacture of more will make it only marginally impact the ability of a criminal or mentally ill individual to obtain one. This is to say nothing of the weapon-substitution effect — many other firearms will do the same thing as an “assault rifle,” but they appear less menacing, so they won’t be banned.

            Likewise, limiting magazine capacity is largely an exercise in futility. A reasonably experienced shooter can change a clip in a couple of seconds. In other words, three 10-round clips are nearly as effective as a single 30-round clip. To be fair, there is some evidence that limiting capacity might reduce the death toll somewhat in mass shootings.

            Individuals who are intent on committing mass murder won’t be deterred by any of the above measures. Seung Hui Cho used two legally purchased handguns, which he accumulated over months, to kill 32 and wound 17 people at Virginia Tech. Timothy McVeigh used only fertilizer and racing fuel to kill 168, including 19 children, and injure 450 others at the Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City.

            So, is there nothing we can do? Clearly, we cannot eliminate all threats, and those who desire to kill will find a way to do so. That said, there are some areas on which everyone can agree: Everyone wants to keep guns out of the hands of criminals and those who are mentally ill.

            In the wake of the Virginia Tech shootings, Congress amended the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) to provide incentives to states to report to prevent mentally unstable people from purchasing firearms. According to a Homeland Security report, 30 states did not make any non-criminal records available to NICS, as of May 1, 2012. Concerns range from privacy issues to cost to technological and bureaucratic barriers. To borrow a phrase from President Obama, “Is this the best we can do?”

            Fixing this problem would not draw the ire of gun owners or gun rights’ groups. It would not require any additional Congressional action, unless it was necessary to alleviate legal privacy issues. The cost would not be that great.

            There is a strong consensus that guns in the hands of criminals and the mentally unstable is the problem. Making access to guns more difficult for the vast majority of gun owners who are law-abiding, responsible citizens, parents, and grandparents does not make any of us any safer. Once we have strengthened the NICS checks, then it may make sense to discuss expanding those checks.

            Finally, it may be worthwhile to consider the school safety recommendations originating with the National Rifle Association. Promising to assemble a group of security experts overseen by former U.S. Attorney, Congressman, Homeland Security and DEA official, Asa Hutchinson, and to go beyond a recommendation of armed personnel at schools, that group could offer concrete suggestions to improve school security.

            Focusing on firearms alone does not address the underlying issue regarding why a person believes that killing many others is the solution to their “problem.” We must examine this societal problem and search for solutions that would do more than just make ourselves feel better in the wake of tragedy.

            Harry Wilson, Ph.D. is the author of "Guns, Gun Control and Elections." He is the director of Roanoke College’s Institute for Policy and Opinion Research, where he also serves as professor of political science.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 4:39 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Bronco: Not so intelligent design...

            HTC: Every engineer can spot a mile away an obvious logic flaw in the argument presented in this video; that is, just because you don't agree with a design decision or think part of the design is 'stupid', doesn't mean that there wasn't an intelligence behind its design.

            It is reasonable to believe that a greater intelligence isn't going to make the same design choices that some of us would, just as engineers frequently differ in their design choices and often think the choices made by other engineers are 'stupid.'

            But to explain away "intelligenct design", one has to explain the complex microbiology of the simplest cell and the origin of life itself, which our astronomer friend hasn't even undertaken to do since it beyond his field of expertise. He makes the same mistake that Darwin did because, like Darwin, he doesn't understand the incredible complexity of the simplest cell, let alone multicellular organisms.

            Theories always look more practical and arguments always seem more plausible when the speaker and the audience know little about the deeper layers of the subject at hand.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 4:31 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Pete posted at 3:31 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013 [thumbup][thumbup]

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 4:30 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Rob123: After investigating, did BofA make you whole plus interest?

            HTC: They recredited me the missing funds, sans interest. I closed my account the next day.

            I couldn't believe how long they argued with me, insisting that I must have withdrawn the funds and forgotten that I had. How many 40-year olds have Alzheimers? They proved that they didn't know the first thing about customer service and the horror stories I've heard from others since then makes it clear that they still haven't learned anything in that department.

             
          • Pete posted at 3:54 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            HighTechCowboy posted at 3:06 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013

            Maybe she settled in Venezuela and got her comeuppance? [wink]

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 3:48 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            The government which is forcing electric cars on us now wants them to be noisy:

            January 8, 2013

            DETROIT (AP) — A U.S. government safety agency wants electric and hybrid vehicles to make more noise when traveling at low speeds so pedestrians can hear them coming.

            The cars and trucks, which are far quieter than conventional gasoline or diesel-powered vehicles, don't make enough noise at low speeds to warn walkers, bicyclists and the visually impaired, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration said Monday in a statement.

            The proposed rule would require the cars to make additional noise at speeds under 18 miles per hour (29 kph). NHTSA says the cars make enough noise to be heard at higher speeds.

            Automakers would be able to pick the sounds that the cars make from a range of choices. Similar vehicles would have to make the same sounds. And the government says pedestrians must be able to hear the sounds over background noises.

            The public has 60 days to comment on the proposed rule. The agency will use public input to craft a final rule.

            NHTSA estimates that the new noise would prevent 2,800 pedestrian and cyclist injuries during the life of each model year of electric and hybrid vans, trucks and cars.

            The rule is required by the Pedestrian Safety Enhancement Act that was passed by Congress in 2010.

             
          • Rob123 posted at 3:37 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            HighTechCowboy posted at 3:06 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            After investigating, did BofA make you whole plus interest?

             
          • Pete posted at 3:31 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            Bronco posted at 12:07 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013

            "I smell hypocrisy in the air..."

            Funny, so do I. The difference being when the Pope - Swaggart - or Olsteen stick out their hand I can tell them to shove it....however "progressives" INSIST non-believers fund their utopian STATE religion under the threat of bureaucratic power, or risk having their humanity questioned by pi$$ant little minions.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 3:28 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Rob123: "Fracking Amazing: US Carbon Emissions in 2012 Will be Lower than in 2007 Due to Fracking"

            HTC: If only Obama wasn't standing in the way of harvesting supplies on public lands. Worse yet, he's now got the EPA looking at ways to regulate fracking out of existence on private lands, where most of it has occurred to date. Not much to celebrate as long as that SOB is still in the White House.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 3:06 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Pete: Bank of America Freezes Gun Manufacturer's Account, Company Owner Claims

            HTC: I quit doing business with BofA over 20 years ago because of a number of problems I had with them as well. The final straw was when one of their employees embezzled $25K from one of my accounts and they insisted that I must have withdrawn it and forgotten that I had. When I finally convinced them to look into it, they discovered that an employee had done it and hit several other customer accounts as well. She apparently made off with over $300K and had fled to South America.

             
          • HRH Prince Michael posted at 2:49 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            HRH Prince Michael Posts: 105

            Yet another great article, Mr. Miele. Sadly, show me a "Religious" "Leader" today, and
            I'll show you a covert partner with Godless "government".
            Suffice to say, for now: "They shall reap, what they have sown".
            The 2013 House of David/Stone Victory, is HERE:
            http://www.all4webs.com/q/f/love4yahweh
            http://www.flickr.com/photos/72265268@N08

             
          • Rob123 posted at 2:34 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            http://reason.com/blog/2013/01/07/fracking-amazing-us-carbon-emissions-low

            "Fracking Amazing: US Carbon Emissions in 2012 Will be Lower than in 2007 Due to Fracking"

            This should cheer everyone up? Except maybe Sargent Major Moose?

             
          • mooseberryinn posted at 12:54 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            mooseberryinn Posts: 2697

            Bronco - what you smell may be your gas output.

             
          • Bronco posted at 12:07 pm on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            Pete: "Today’s regnant agnosticism has its own dogmas and is extremely intolerant regarding anything that would question it and the criteria it employs."---Pope Benedict
            ----------------------------
            I smell hypocrisy in the air...

            Although the particular inclination of the homosexual person is not a sin, it is more or less strong tendency ordered to an intrinsic moral evil, and thus the inclination itself must be seen as an objective disorder.--Pope Benedict XVI

            To create a legal form of a kind of homosexual marriage, in reality, does not help these people.
            Pope Benedict XVI

            The fact that the church is convinced of not having the right to confer priestly ordination on women is now considered by some as irreconcilable with the European Constitution.
            Pope Benedict XVI

            Not all moral issues have the same moral weight as abortion and euthanasia. There may be legitimate diversity of opinion even among Catholics about waging war and applying the death penalty, but not... with regard to abortion and euthanasia.
            Pope Benedict XVI

            Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the church is often labeled today as fundamentalism. Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along by every wind of teaching, look like the only attitude acceptable to today's standards.
            Pope Benedict XVI

             
          • Pete posted at 11:46 am on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            “Today’s regnant agnosticism has its own dogmas and is extremely intolerant regarding anything that would question it and the criteria it employs,” the pope said. “Therefore the courage to contradict the prevailing mindset is particularly urgent for a bishop today. He must be courageous,” he added. - Pope Benedict

             
          • Pete posted at 11:44 am on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            Bronco posted at 11:02 am on Tue, Jan 8, 2013

            "...are they human?"

            I should be surprised by that....but I'm not.

             
          • Bronco posted at 11:02 am on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            House Republicans...are they human? Too shallow to tell...

            http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mon-january-7-2013/c--k-block-you-on-the-hurricane?xrs=synd_facebook

             
          • Pete posted at 10:53 am on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            College Park couple says front yard vegetable garden is under fire again

            http://www.clickorlando.com/news/College-Park-couple-says-front-yard-vegetable-garden-is-under-fire-again/-/1637132/18035884/-/png2kpz/-/index.html

             
          • Pete posted at 10:47 am on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            Bank of America Freezes Gun Manufacturer's Account, Company Owner Claims

            http://cnsnews.com/blog/gregory-gwyn-williams-jr/bank-america-freezes-gun-manufacturers-account-company-owner-claims

             
          • Bronco posted at 9:34 am on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            Not so intelligent design...

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nyASa0hg2qU

             
          • Rob123 posted at 6:19 am on Tue, Jan 8, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            Rumor has it that after the Notre Dame - Alabama BCS game last night, the Pope was rereading his "Portable Nietzsche"? At least he is educated enough to stick to Kauffman's translation.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 8:06 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/01/04/1176367/-America-Now-Has-a-Three-Major-Political-Parties

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 7:13 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            It's a beautiful day posted at 6:51 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013

            Rant on, my delusional friend, for I'm done with you. There's no sense in trying to communicate with those whose feet don't touch the ground. Post away but I'll be ignoring you from this point on.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 6:59 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            You never know what that consummate charlatan Paul Krugman will recommend next:

            http://blogs.marketwatch.com/election/2013/01/07/krugman-joins-the-1-trillion-coin-brigade/

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 6:55 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            The new ObamaCare regulations which went into effect as of this January 1 are so complicated that it took a full 18 pages just to describe what a "full time" employee is:

            http://www.forbes.com/sites/gracemarieturner/2012/10/28/the-avalanche-of-new-obamacare-rules-will-come-in-january-2013/

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 6:51 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            HighTechCowboy posted at 5:39 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013

            IABD: http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/2013/01/06/matt-damons-fracking-movie-depicts-gas-companies-as-liars/

            HTC: Damon's fracking movie is a complete fraud. Even the EPA has publicly acknowledged that fact. Do your homework. You're boring me, sonny.

            HighTechCowboy posted at 7:06 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            IABD: Mr. H, Agnostics are like atheists with a type B personality disorder.

            HTC: Yeah, right. That's me -definitely a Type B personalilty.

            IABD: By the way, when did you suddenly side with the EPA's critical theorist's?

            HTC: Where in the world did you get the insane idea that I've sided with the EPA? He//, I'd abolish most of that jack-booted, science-challenged pool of incompetent tyrants. When CO2 was classified as a 'pollutant', the EPA proved that they deserved to go the way of the dinosaurs.

            IABD: For more info on type B personality disorders: http://www.mentalhelp.net/poc/view_doc.php?type=doc&id=564

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 6:50 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            IABD: President Obama naturally having DNA going back thousands of years existing above the smog level in the mountains of Kenya would naturally have more mental clarity than you two at any altitude.

            HTC: Yeah, the first presidential debate gave us a clear example of that superior "mental clarity."
            [lol]

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 6:45 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            IABD: That is due to global warming. Warmer winters reduce demand for natural gas prices. GAWD your intelligunt Mr. H. Did you put mooseberry syrup on your waffles this morning too?

            HTC: You really are the idiot's idiot if you thing global warming is behind the steep drop in natural gas prices rather than the recent discovery of over 200 years worth of natural gas deposits within the U.S., thanks to deep horizontal drilling and fracking.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 6:41 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            mooseberryinn posted at 11:34 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013

            In the last 90 days alone, the Obama administration has issued over 5500 new regulatory proposals! They deliberately choose the holiday season because of the distraction it provides.

            One of my favorite new Obama regulations: A household may not own more than four cats.

            Yeah, really. Don't you feel 'protected' by this new Messiah?

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 6:35 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            kohana posted at 11:02 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013

            Thank you for the clarification.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 6:34 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            IABD: You are showing signs of senile dementia Mr. H. displayed with your redundancy.

            HTC: If I repeat myself, it is due to your inability to understand the obvious.

            IABD: You however know quite well that the Keystone Pipeline project, in order to be profitable, fuel prices must climb to around $6.00 a gallon at the pumps.

            HTC: I know no such thing because it isn't true. Crude must be above approximately $60 a barrel for it to be profitable but that doesn't look like it will be a problem any time soon.

             
          • Rob123 posted at 6:26 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            It's a beautiful day posted at 6:08 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            Peter Grace, and WRGrace, Inc., are from Boston. WRGrace bought the Zonolite Mill in Libby around 1963+/-. The first thing they did was tear down the old Dry Mill and set up a Wet Mill, to lower the dust levels. Go figure, eh?

            Are their connections to the Nazis and the Grace or Krupp or many other families. YES, although it was German Nationalism and not necessarily Nazi Loyalty. Take a look at the role of Nationalism, here and around the world, if you want to dig into 'Stupid'.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 6:08 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            Mr. H, If you are doubting the one website listed, try googling (W.R.Grace and Company, operation paperclip). There are hundreds of sites including official government files. Many ex-nazi's moved to Montana and the pacific NW post WW2 because of the similar seasons, geography and lack of available real estate in Germany.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 5:42 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            IABD: In 1982 Reagan appointed then W.R. Grace CEO J. Peter Grace as head of the Grace Commission, who then recommended deep cuts to the EPA, thus slowing their investigation of W.R. Grace's site in Libby. Check out the article website below which ties WR Grace to the Nazi's.

            HTC: The 600+ Grace Commission Report did NOT recommend deep cuts to the EPA; in fact, it found it understaffed and unable to handle the permitting and review workload it faced, as well as critical clean up tasks. Following its recommendation, Reagan sought a substantial increase in its budget at a time when he was looking to reduce costs in almost every other agency.

            As for the NAZI B.S., you really do need to find better sources or at least higher caliber garbage.

             
          • kohana posted at 5:41 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            Bronco, you are wrong, gGod isn't going to punish mooseberryinn for telling the truth and resisting evil. Read Dt. 13:6 etc, "And thou shalt eradicate the evil from your midst," evil is something to be eradicated, to be resisted. A communist thug in our White House is an evil.
            What Obama is doing to our country is sad, and what is even worse, you and others don't even recognize the evil in our government.

             
          • Bronco posted at 5:08 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            Ya know, mooseberryinn, for a man who believes in gGod as deeply as you do, you sure aren't afraid of his punishment for being such a mean-mouthed hater. Perhaps you should read some of those guidelines in that magic book of yours. You know, see how the gGuy upstairs expects you to behave.

             
          • mooseberryinn posted at 4:11 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            mooseberryinn Posts: 2697

            IABD - El Presidente, Comrade, Chairman, Most Holy of Holies, Guru of Gurus Obama may well be very intelligent. I'm sure his advisors stand in awe of his abilities. It's just a shame that he's a communist, and in the midst of destroying America in the process of transforming us. But then, you will learn that one day.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 2:42 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            kohana posted at 2:03 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            Have you considered you and mooseberry may be living proof of the 2013 version of Planet of the Apes? President Obama naturally having DNA going back thousands of years existing above the smog level in the mountains of Kenya would naturally have more mental clarity than you two at any altitude.

             
          • kohana posted at 2:03 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            mooseberryinn posted at 11:34 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013

            He's been busy since the '90s wrecking our country, he is just now trying to finish it off.

             
          • Bronco posted at 1:53 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            Why 'Making room for gGod" in our world is delusion:

            Many billions of people make room for gGod in the world as we speak. Yet it is not the utopia many of us wish for. Is there a specific percentage of the world's population that must capitulate to gGod's whims in order for him to give succor? Why hasn't he taken care of the faithful and granted their boons?

            Self-hynosis works for the likes of mooseberryinn. But people who choose critical thinking over faith will never self-anesthetize themselves with delusional thoughts in order to avoid reality.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 12:47 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            Bronco posted at 11:07 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013

            Bronco- "So...the 'inspired Word of gGod', aka the Creator? I suppose the 'inspiration' was through mental telepathy so no one could question the source."

            IABD- You may be on to something. Neanderthal telepaths may still exist in Gnostic temples in France or possibly in the mountains of Afghanistan.

            From Wikipedia: "In William Shatner's Quest for Tomorrow series of novels, Neanderthals were a primitive psychic species which caught the eye of a large alien empire. They decided to try to isolate the telepathic gene and transplanted several subjects to another world. The original Neanderthals were eliminated so that no one else gets the same idea. The h0m0 sapiens were left alone. The transplanted Neanderthals eventually evolved into an industrial society. However, this took much longer than it did for humanity, as a telepathic species would have problems inventing complex technology without the use of writing - an unnecessary tool for telepaths. The Neanderthals eventually joined together and transcended their physical shape, becoming a god-like being."

            "In The Silk Code by Paul Levinson (winner of 1999 Locus Award for Best First Novel), Neanderthals are still living in Basque country in 750 AD, and a few survive in the present world."

             
          • kohana posted at 12:33 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            Another thing. Judaism does not teach that the bible is the inspired word of gGod. They know it was written by men, notice they didn't even note Moses' burial place. Man was not to be worshiped or given too great an honor. Respect, yes. The only part of the bible that was "God" inspired was the "LAW" which was given at Mt. Sinai, in front of the entire Hebrew people. They all heard gGod, and it scared the stuffing out them. Exodus Ch 19. It matters not if the events took place exactly as described in Ex: 19, it only matters what the people believed and what they acted upon.

            How odd of God to choose the Jews. (William Norman Ewer)
            Not so odd, the Jews chose God.

            But not so odd
            As those who choose
            A Jewish God
            Yet spurn the Jews (Cecil Brown or Ogden Nash)

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 12:13 pm on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            HighTechCowboy posted at 5:37 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013

            HTC-"Have you failed to notice the dramatic drop in natural gas prices?"

            IABD- That is due to global warming. Warmer winters reduce demand for natural gas prices. GAWD your intelligunt Mr. H. Did you put mooseberry syrup on your waffles this morning too?

             
          • kohana posted at 11:57 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            Rob123 posted at 10:49 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013

            Because Karl Marx (1818-1883) threw out the baby with the bath water.

            He was not a brilliant Talmudic scholar/philosopher like Maimonides (1135-1204, Guide to the Perplexed) and Spinoza (1632-1677, The Ethics of Spinoza), or even Rashi born in 1040 AD. Rashi's commentaries are still included today in the Torah. My Torah has the Hebrew across the top of the page with the English translation below, and Rashi and other sages' commentaries below that. Plus Talmud commentaries at the end of each chapter.

            These Talmudic scholars tried to bring the massive amounts of information in the Talmud down to understandable size. But just reading these scholars without any background will still leave you spinning with misunderstanding. They wrote for other scholars, not lay people.

             
          • mooseberryinn posted at 11:34 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            mooseberryinn Posts: 2697

            Another subject: Want to feel depressed? Google - "new Obama regulations for 2013". Wow, El Presidente, Comrade, Emperor Obama has really been a busy little wrecking ball!

             
          • mooseberryinn posted at 11:32 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            mooseberryinn Posts: 2697

            Bronco - you're sounding like a petulant adolescent who didn't get his way. Too bad. If you chose to learn, you may be richer for the effort. but... I'm sure you won't. I pity you.

             
          • Bronco posted at 11:07 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            mooseberryinn: The Christian Bible for the more informed among us, is the "inspired word of God as written down by the people of the time".

            HTC: Prove them wrong or incomplete on issues of science all you want, but you're wasting your time on a fool's errand because that is not what they purport to be.
            ---------------------------
            So...the 'inspired Word of gGod', aka the Creator? I suppose the 'inspiration' was through mental telepathy so no one could question the source. If gGod created everything (once there was nothing except gGod, then he made everything come into existence, and he hates gays) why does he not have a clue how it all works? We face two rational choices:
            A. He did not inspire the bible
            B. He lead us away from the truth on purpose
            Then we have gGod's ghost banging away on a married Jewish girl (or unmarried, depends on which inspired gospel you want to buy into), she has his son, who is actually him. Then he gets strung up only to cry out to himself "Why have I forsaken me?" when he should have just smiled and said, "All's going according to my divine plan, tee hee."

            But then, people sure know a lot about Bigfoot but have never seen it either.

             
          • mooseberryinn posted at 11:06 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            mooseberryinn Posts: 2697

            Kohana 1/7/13 10:49. [thumbup]

            Very well done.

             
          • kohana posted at 11:02 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            HighTechCowboy posted at 8:20 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013
            "In the case of the Jewish, ... and that those who do will enjoy life everlasting in some kind of heaven/paradise."

            Main Stream Judaism does not teach this. Some off shoots may and did, (Essenes, the early Christians) but for the most part the obligation is to make the here and now a more perfect place through correct conduct, the way we treat our fellows, our planet and the creatures for which we were put in charge. Should there be an afterlife, it will take care of itself if our conduct is correct.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 10:58 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            HighTechCowboy posted at 5:37 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            HTC: Ummm....Have you failed to notice that gas prices have dropped by roughly 50 cents a gallon in the last few months? Have you failed to notice the dramatic drop in natural gas prices?

            IABD- Where do you get your fuel price information?http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/01/04/gasoline-prices-starting-to-rise-again/1810175/

            HighTechCowboy posted at 7:51 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013

            IABD: Where do you get your fuel price information?
            HTC: Do you mean that you don't believe that gas prices dropped by over 50 cents/gallon during the last few months of 2012?

            IABD- You are showing signs of senile dementia Mr. H. displayed with your redundancy. You however know quite well that the Keystone Pipeline project, in order to be profitable, fuel prices must climb to around $6.00 a gallon at the pumps.

             
          • Rob123 posted at 10:49 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            kohana posted at 10:25 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            [smile] So why do you give Karl Marx such a hard time for continuing the tradition? Or do you give everybody a hard time? Inquiring minds want to 'know'.

             
          • kohana posted at 10:25 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            Gads, I keep telling you all that the bible has a “how to” book that goes along with it. If another religion is going to plagiarize someone else’s work, especially without permission, it needs to understand what it is taking.

            The bible is the cornerstone of Judaism, and the Talmud is the central pillar, shaping spiritual content and serving as a guide to conduct. The formal definition of the Talmud is the summary of oral law that evolved after centuries of scholarly effort by sages who lived in Palestine and Babylonia until the beginning of the Middle Ages. The Talmud is the repository of thousands of years of Jewish wisdom, and the oral law, which is as ancient and significant as the written law. (Torah, 1st 5 books of the bible).

            All Jews know the book of Genesis is the written stories passed down from the centuries of oral tales. The sages of the time memorized those stories. The 6 days of creation could be 6 billion years. Some of the stories were metaphors. There are 2 creation stories, one where men and women were created and told to be fruitful and multiply. The second story is of Adam and Eve. The Christians use the story to explain how we are all born sinful and need to be “SAVED.” The Jews wrote the story to explain that we are responsible for the choices we make. Adam blamed Eve, and Eve blamed the snake.

            The story of Cain and Able, to teach us not to kill each other, was probably about 1000 years before the 10 commandments. The story of Abraham and Isaac was to forbid human sacrifice, which was the prevailing ritual of most of the pagan cults of the time. However, those of you who believe the bible “came straight out of gGod’s mouth” have no intention of understanding a volume of work for which they have never been properly introduced. The sages forbade the study of Torah without a learned guide because they knew what would happen is exactly what has happened, you all interpret the works anyway you please, then claim you have the truth because it is gGod’s word.

            The book of Job, by the way, is strictly a book of fiction, included in the writings for its message that bad things do happen to good people through no fault of their own.

            Piers Morgan’s statement that the bible is inherently flawed and needs to be amended shows his total ignorance, because the Talmud is about thousands of years of amendments to the bible, and he knows nothing about it. And neither do most of the rest of the people who believe the bible is the work of some gGod.


             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 9:49 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            HighTechCowboy posted at 7:33 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            IABD- Making room for GAWD, your right Mr. H...Prior EPA's before Reagan were aware of the Libby asbestos problem but ignored the local residents of Libby. With Reagan's Budget cuts most environmental problems and solutions in America were ignored.______________________

            W.R. Grace Inc.'s Prior Knowledge of Risks of Asbestosis Ignored in Federal Court

            In 1982 Reagan appointed then W.R. Grace CEO J. Peter Grace as head of the Grace Commission, who then recommended deep cuts to the EPA, thus slowing their investigation of W.R. Grace's site in Libby. Check out the article website below which ties WR Grace to the Nazi's.

            http://www.culturechange.org/cms/content/view/530/1/

            President Reagan was very popular with to the public by ending every speech with "God Bless America." Before Reagan only Nixon said "God Bless America." It was like putting Heinz 57 on a Ritz craker for the GOP.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 8:20 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Bronco posted at 11:00 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            I was referring to the much broader subject of science vs. religion, not just Christianity and the Bible.

            All religions struggle with the core issues of where we (and life in general) came from, why we exist, and what happens when we die. These are the important questions that science cannot answer.

            In the case of the Jewish, Christian and Islamic faiths, the 'answers' to those questions are that God created everything; that we exist to please and serve him; and that those who do will enjoy life everlasting in some kind of heaven/paradise.

            As I've previously indicated, I am agnostic, but I do recognize that science has more questions than answers on all these issues; that is, unless one puts one's head into the sand and pretends otherwise.

            If you want to pretend that the Bible and other religious works are supposedly science books instead of religious and philosophical documents, go right ahead. Prove them wrong or incomplete on issues of science all you want, but you're wasting your time on a fool's errand because that is not what they purport to be.


             
          • Rob123 posted at 8:11 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            kohana posted at 7:44 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            You have to watch the dates posted at individual sites, as these prices are somehow pulled off of Credit Card Transactions, and some folks don't submit their Credit Card Batches into the huge collection centers every few hours. Some only every couple days, apparently? So make sure the date is fresh.....Concerning Premium and the level of Ethanol.......I sell both types, normal 10% and Ethanol Free, clearly marked on the pump(s). Pay attention!

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 7:51 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            IABD: Where do you get your fuel price information?

            HTC: Do you mean that you don't believe that gas prices dropped by over 50 cents/gallon during the last few months of 2012?

            In fact, from the peak in mid-September to the end of the year, national gas prices dropped by 57 cents a gallon:

            http://ycharts.com/indicators/gas_price

            There's no evil conspiracy by our oil companies to keep prices artificially high. There is by Obama, however, as his insane energy policies are guaranteed to do just that and to keep us dependent upon foreign oil. He's either a complete idiot on energy matters or he intentionally wants to price fossil fuels beyond most peoples' reach. That latter is 'evil' by any reasonable standard.

            But he's your guy, so you'll never look at that situation honestly and objectively.

            A lot of people expect oil prices and the price of fuels derived from them to follow the 'laws' of supply and demand; thus, they wonder why prices often go up during periods of reduced demand.

            What they overlook is that those 'laws' only work in largely free markets and the fossil fuel business is anything but a free market; in fact, it is one of the most highly regulated and government-controlled industry segments.

            Supply is tightly regulated, not only by OPEC by also by our progressive-dominated federal government which is ignorantly wasting tens of billions of dollars of taxpayer money on unreliable and expensive 'alternative' energy as it simultaneously restricts access to fossil fuels.

            The Federal Reserve's printing of money, euphemistically termed "quantitative easing", is cheapening the dollar and driving up the price of all that we import, including foreign oil.

            But the biggest wildcard of all is the refinery end of the business. Thanks to Democrats and their brain-damaged ethanol-in-gasoline scheme, the only new refineries that we've built since 1974 are ethanol refineries. The addition of ethanol to fuel not only reduces mileage, increasing gasoline consumption overall, but also dramatically adds to ozone which is becoming a major problem in urban areas; in fact, the CDC estimates that roughly 90% of the people diagnosed with nonspecific allergies in the past 10 years are actually reacting to increased ozone levels in their area.

            The list of ways that progressives have damaged our lives is nearly infinite and is only matched by the ignorance of those who vote for them.

             
          • kohana posted at 7:44 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109


            Rob123 posted at 3:18 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013

            That's pretty neat! $2.99 all along Hwy 93 and Hwy 2. Couple of places with premium about $3.60. Since they have upped the amount of ethanol I've switched from regular. Need to keep that old clunker of mine running as long as possible.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 7:33 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            IABD: I agree with you regarding the EPA. C02 became a problem when Peter J Grace of WR Grace was appointed by President Reagan to head the EPA in 1980.

            HTC: What planet did you say you came from?

            Reagan had three EPA Administrators, NONE of whom was Peter Grace. Anne Gorsuch (later Anne Gorsuch Burford) served him from 1981-1983; William Ruckelshaus (the very first EPA Administrator when Nixon created the agency) served from 1983-1985; and Lee Thomas served from 1985-1989.

            IABD: Now still to this day we are stuck with a dangerous nation forest policy of "let it burn."

            HTC: Our current policy towards fire management was developed LONG after Reagan. I find it interesting that you refer to that policy, which is essentially mother nature's approach, as "dangerous." Certainly many of those fires are bigger, hotter and faster moving because of decades of poor forest management which allowed increadible levels of fuel to build up in our forests.

            And the liberal envirowhacko groups are so brain-damaged that they won't even let us go after much of that dead, standing timber even AFTER a big fire.

             
          • Rob123 posted at 7:33 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            Moose: " I believe there are probably classes available should you seek to learn."

            That doesn't always work. I tremble whenever I insert a piece of personal history, as Pete circles like a buzzard looking for a bite......but I spent 4 years with the good fathers of the Holy Cross, graduating a confirmed Agnostic. But, I did enjoy the lessons in what I came to consider Art History, but the priests called Religion. One had to have 12 credit hours of "Religion" to graduate, even geeky Engineer College Grads. Thank gGod for espresso! Being a private University with small classes and much eye contact, it was hard to NOT study. Grades, however, were dispersed by the amount of work done on the subject matter, not IF one had a Fish Hook in ones mouth.
            And what you call "The Gift of Faith".......as you know, that's problematic, to say the least. And totally beyond Reason and Discourse, although the use of the word "Gift" instead of some other word says a lot about the branch of Christianity that you probably embrace. Fortunately, the Constitution allows for a very large Supermarket, with an Organic Section. Whew!

             
          • mooseberryinn posted at 6:44 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            mooseberryinn Posts: 2697

            OK - just to kick the anthill for laughs. beginning now Jan 2013. Over 400 new regulations take effect. Many are bizarre, but one that just made me laugh - It is now illegal to own more than 4 cats. Ya just gotta admit this Obama regime is hilarious. (in a pathetic sorta way). Then, there is "Bronco and the Bible" - maybe it's just a case of no one visiting his rock, or holding the rock up to talk with him? Whatever. The Christian Bible for the more informed among us, is the "inspired word of God as written down by the people of the time". Now, I think there is where your understanding goes astray. To comprehend more of the Bible one must try to think from the view point of the people of that era. I believe there are probably classes available should you seek to learn.

             
          • Pete posted at 6:07 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            HighTechCowboy posted at 9:58 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013

            Hey, if the rhetoric keeps working why stop using it? Besides, if folks start rolling their eyes at it, they will simply dust off the next line of circular logic....It's Bush's fault. Whatever they need to do to protect the holy grail of "collective" ideology they will do. After all, socialism hasn't failed humanity - humanity has failed socialism.

             
          • Rob123 posted at 3:43 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            It's a beautiful day posted at 7:48 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.
            "I agree with you regarding the EPA. C02 became a problem when Peter J Grace of WR Grace was appointed by President Reagan to head the EPA in 1980."

            OUCH! I think Peter just rolled over in his grave, raised his buttocks, and said something along the lines of "Kiss my bony Azz".....[wink]

             
          • Rob123 posted at 3:18 am on Mon, Jan 7, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            kohana posted at 7:37 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            http://www.cspnet.com/news/fuels/articles/rocky-mountain-low?utm_source=SilverpopMailing&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Daily+News+01-07-2013+%281%29&utm_content=&spMailingID=40786418&spUserID=MjU0MDQ1ODU1MjQS1&spJobID=173201399&spReportId=MTczMjAxMzk5S0#.UOqgJqJRdTM.email

            http://autos.msn.com/everyday/GasStations.aspx?station=433643&lat=48.45921&long=-115.8932&ico=308&m=1&l=1&zip=59923#map

             
          • Bronco posted at 11:00 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            HighTechCowboy posted at 5:28 pm HTC: What things has 'science' explained away?
            ----------------------------
            Wow. Really? I mean 'duh really', not the garden variety.

            Start with Genesis? Plants created before the sun? Earth created in 6-days?

            Leviticus 17:11 (written 3000 years ago): "For the life of the flesh is in the blood."
            Blood is just one of a number of body fluids that are essential for life. Others include: lymphatic fluid, cerebrospinal fluid, synovial fluid, and urine. They are all necessary for survival.

            Consider the Bible's foolproof method for eliminating leprosy from a dwelling. (See Lev. 14:36-54)
            To summarize the process, it involves a priest entering the house in which an infected individual had lived. If he sees red and green stripes/spots on the walls under the surface, he closes the house and returns after seven days. If, when he returns, he sees the spots have spread, he orders removal of the affected parts of the wall. After that, he orders all the walls to be thoroughly scraped and the removed section to be replaced.
            But, if after this procedure, the spots appear and spread again, the priest concludes that the infected person had leprosy and the house is defiled. In this case he orders it to be destroyed. However, if the spots have not reappeared, the priest declares the house clean and the leprosy to have been eliminated. And now the fun begins.
            If the house is pronounced clean, he next performs a cleansing ceremony which involves the use of two birds, cedar wood, scarlet thread, and hyssop branches. He kills one of the birds over a bowl of water. Then he dips the living bird, the cedar wood, the hyssop branch, and the scarlet thread into the bloody water from the killed bird. Then he sprinkles this concoction on the walls of the house seven times, and poof, the house gets the Good Housekeeping Seal of Approval. But wait, there's more. He then releases the living bird into the boondocks as a gesture of atonement.

            How about Noah and the Great Flood? Floating at over 25,000 ft. above sea level raises some questions. Namely, did Noah have enough oxygen bottles and masks for 'two of every kind'? The available amount of oxygen to sustain mental and physical alertness decreases above 10,000 feet. The Time of Useful Consciousness is a function of altitude. At 20,000 feet, an average individual will have 5 to 12 minutes. At 25,000 feet, this time is reduced to 3 to 5 minutes. Or heat? The temperature there hovers around -60 degrees.

            Job 26:7 (written 3500 years ago): "He stretches out the north over the empty place, and hangs the earth upon nothing." Also, contradictory so... 1 Chron. 16:30 ...the world also shall be stable, that it be not moved. Psa. 93:1 ...the world also is stablished, that it cannot be moved. Psa. 96:10 ...the world also shall be established that it shall not be moved: Psa. 104:5 [Who] laid the foundations of the earth, [that] it should not be removed for ever. Job. 26:11 "The pillars of heaven tremble..." 2 Sam. 22:8 "...the foundations of heaven moved..." Rather than hanging on nothing, these verses depict the earth and heavens as being firmly fixed on some kind of solid foundation or pillars.
            Science has explained this also. The Earth hangs on the gravitational fields of the sun, moon, and other planets in its vicinity. It is, of course, this attraction that keeps the earth in orbit around the sun. Not only did
            the author of Job not know that the earth revolved around the sun (or rotated on its axis for that matter), he did not know anything about gravitation fields because they are invisible and God apparently neglected to tell him about them.

            Job 38:19 (written 3500 years ago). "Where is the way where light dwells? And darkness, where is the place thereof?" They thought that light and darkness were two independent entities that dwell in different locations.

            Ecclesiastes 1:6 The wind goes toward the south, And turns around to the north; The wind whirls about continually, And comes again on its circuit.
            Science says that the overall circulation is longitudinally from the west to the east (in a circuit around the earth) driving the earth's weather systems along with them.

            Jonah in the belly of the whale for three days...enough said. See: oxygen, digestive acids.

            I tire of this. Point proven. Science rules.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 9:58 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Pete posted at 7:36 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            Have you noticed that the MSM still refers to the "cliff" bill as having spared the middle class ANY tax increases, even though they all saw a significant jump in payroll taxes and will also see an increase in the so-called "marriage penalty?"

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 9:55 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            It's a beautiful day posted at 7:48 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013

            Stanford University (substantiated by others since then) demonstrated that the government's forced addition of ethanol to gasoline has substantially increased ozone production, reduced fuel economy and shortens the life of many engine parts. And for what, since they also proved that it is completely unnecessary in today's automobiles that have ECMs, fuel-injection systems and oxygen sensors to precisely mix fuel and air?

            So why do we have the ethanol mandate? Ask the Democrats and the big corporate ethanol refineries and corn/sugar beet growers that are in bed with them.

            Oh, wait - isn't that supposed to be the GOP that does that sort of thing?

             
          • Pete posted at 7:49 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            It's a beautiful day posted at 7:03 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013

            "Someday in a million zillion years you may have the sense of listening but Gawd it will be a long time for you to grow ears."

            Maybe by then you will have something cogent to say and we'll both be happy. [beam]

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 7:48 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            HighTechCowboy posted at 7:06 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013

            I agree with you regarding the EPA. C02 became a problem when Peter J Grace of WR Grace was appointed by President Reagan to head the EPA in 1980.

            CO2 is indeed poisoning our planet but there must be a balance with nature.

            "Trees cause pollution" is a gloriously stupid concept foisted upon the public in 1981 by U.S. President Ronald Reagan. The full quote of his statement was, "Trees cause more pollution than automobiles do."[1]

            Reagan was falsely referencing the photochemical reaction that causes ground level ozone pollution (GLOP), also known as photochemical smog.[2] Smog is created when automobile and power plant emissions are broken down into ozone and other chemicals by strong sunlight. These reactions are amplified by the presence of various volatile organic compounds, or VOCs.[3] During hot weather many tree species release volatile organic compounds into the atmosphere, notably terpenes and isoprenes[4] (pine pitch is a terpene). Other VOCs that contribute to GLOP include gasoline, kerosene, paint, paint thinner and other industrial solvents.

            Reagan's statement was disingenuous because volatile organic compounds produced by trees do not cause pollution any more than the sun causes pollution. Reagan might as well have said, "the sun causes more pollution than automobiles do." Photochemical ozone pollution is created when automobile and power plant pollution is broken down by strong sunlight in the presence of any number of volatile organic compounds.

            GLOP or photochemical smog is only created in areas that receive large amounts of pollution from automobiles and power plants.[5] Trees are not required to create it. Without the input of large amounts of man made nitrogen oxides by cars and power plants, the VOCs released by forests on a summer day have nothing to react with and they do not create any pollution. In reality, photochemical smog is very harmful to trees.http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Trees_cause_pollution

            IABD-Now still to this day we are stuck with a dangerous nation forest policy of "let it burn."

             
          • laker1 posted at 7:43 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            laker1 Posts: 112

            Granted that Our Dear Editor’s default mode is that we are three days away from the end of the world/western civilization/United States as we know it, I wonder if there were a more mundane explanation for the latest rendition of the Fall.
            .
            On January 1, 2013, the Daily Interlake made changes to its format and, I think, raised its price per copy. See “New year, new look for Inter Lake”, http://dailyinterlake.com/news/local_montana/article_778aca76-539e-11e2-9810-0019bb2963f4.html . Though Our Dear Editor has announced CHANGES to the newspaper in the past, this article appears without any byline. Hmmm.

            More disturbing, I compared the pages in the December 30th and January 6th issues of the Sunday Daily Interlake:

            12/30 - 1/6
            News - Section A: 12 – 8
            Sports - Section B: 8 – 6
            Montana Life - Section C: 10 – 10
            Classified - Section D: 10 - 10
            Totals: 40 – 34

            Two caveats are appropriate. First, the number of pages varies over the year. I think this depends on the amount of advertising so it might be that my comparison is an anomaly. It will be interesting to see what happens. Second, until several years ago, Montana Life (Section C) used to be two separate sections. One section concerned social and cultural matters; the other had editorial features like Editor’s Two Cents, op-eds, and letters to the editor. They have appeared in separate sections a few times since, usually during ad-rich December.

            Would I be wrong in thinking that these CHANGES to Our Dear Editor’s newspaper might be unwelcome and are the source of his discontent? Do inquiring minds want to know? Not really, I mean, print and newspapers are so passé.

             
          • kohana posted at 7:37 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            Actually IABD, I drove through Kalispell Friday and most of the prices were in the $3.29 range, but I did see one sign for $2.99. A year ago it was near $5. a gal. Higher in CA. It was $3.33 here in Bigfork on Thursday. I haven't been out in a few days but will check it tomorrow.

             
          • Pete posted at 7:36 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            CURL: Obama supporters shocked, angry at new tax increases

            Sometimes, watching a Democrat learn something is wonderful, like seeing the family dog finally sit and stay at your command.

            With President Obama back in office and his life-saving “fiscal cliff” bill jammed through Congress, the new year has brought a surprising turn of events for his sycophantic supporters.

            “What happened that my Social Security withholding’s in my paycheck just went up?” a poster wrote on the liberal site DemocraticUnderground.com. “My paycheck just went down by an amount that I don’t feel comfortable with. I guarantee this decrease is gonna’ hurt me more than the increase in income taxes will hurt those making over 400 grand. What happened?”

            Shocker. Democrats who supported the president’s re-election just had NO idea that his steadfast pledge to raise taxes meant that he was really going to raise taxes. They thought he planned to just hit those filthy “1 percenters,” you know, the ones who earned fortunes through their inventiveness and hard work. They thought the free ride would continue forever.

            So this week, as taxes went up for millions of Americans — which Republicans predicted throughout the campaign would happen — it was fun to watch the agoggery of the left.

            “I know to expect between $93 and $94 less in my paycheck on the 15th,” wrote the ironically named “RomneyLies.”

            “My boyfriend has had a lot of expenses and is feeling squeezed right now, and having his paycheck shrink really didn’t help,” wrote “DemocratToTheEnd.”

            “BlueIndyBlue” added: “Many of my friends didn’t realize it, either. Our payroll department didn’t do a good job of explaining the coming changes.”

            So let’s explain something to our ill-informed Democratic friends. In 2009, Mr. Obama enacted a “holiday” on the payroll tax deduction from employees’ paychecks, dropping the rate from 6.2 percent to 4.2 percent. But like the holidays, the drop ended, and like New Year‘s, the revelers woke up the next morning with a massive hangover and a pounding head.

            “Bake,” who may have been trolling the site, jumped into the thread posted Friday. “My paycheck just went down. So did my wife’s. This hurts us. But everybody says it’s a good thing, so I guess we just suck it up and get used to it. I call it a tax increase on the middle class. I wonder what they call it. Somebody on this thread called it a ‘premium.’ Nope. It’s a tax, and it just went up.”

            Some in the thread argued that the new tax — or the end of the “holiday,” which makes it a new tax — wouldn’t really amount to much. One calculated it would cost about $86 a month for most people.

            “Honeycombe8,” though, said that amount is nothing to sneeze at.
            “$86 a month is a lot. That would pay for … Groceries for a week, as someone said. More than what I pay for parking every month, after my employer’s contribution to that. A new computer after a year. A new quality pair of shoes … every month. Months of my copay for my hormones. A new thick coat (on sale or at discount place). It would pay for what I spend on my dogs every month … food, vitamins, treats.”

            The Twittersphere was even funnier.
            “Really, how am I ever supposed to pay off my student loans if my already small paycheck keeps getting smaller? Help a sister out, Obama,” wrote “Meet Virginia.” “Nancy Thongkham” was much more furious. “F***ing Obama! F*** you! This taking out more taxes s*** better f***ing help me out!! Very upset to see my paycheck less today!”

            “_Alex™” sounded bummed. “Obama I did not vote for you so you can take away alot of money from my checks.” Christian Dixon seemed crestfallen. “I’m starting to regret voting for Obama.” But “Dave” got his dander up over the tax hike: “Obama is the biggest f***ing liar in the world. Why the f*** did I vote for him”?

            Of course, dozens of posters on DemocraticUnderground sought to blame it all (as usual) on President George W. Bush. “Your taxes went up because the leaders need to dig us out of this criminal deficit hole we are in which has been caused because taxes were too low during the Bush years. Everyone has to help by spreading the wealth around a little. Power to the correct people!” posted “Orinoco.”

            But in fact, it was Mr. Obama who enacted the “holiday,” and, to be clear, the tax cut that he pushed throughout the campaign — remember? 98 percent of Americans will get a cut under his plan? — was really the extension of the Bush tax suts. Thus, it was Mr. Obama who raised taxes on millions of Americans, not Mr. Bush.

            How many Americans? The nonpartisan Tax Policy Center in Washington put the total at 77.1 percent of all wage earners. In fact, “More than 80 percent of households with incomes between $50,000 and $200,000 would pay higher taxes. Among the households facing higher taxes, the average increase would be $1,635, the policy center said,” according to a Bloomberg News article. Hilariously, the tax burden will rise more for someone making $30,000 a year (1.7 percent) than it does for someone earning $500,000 annually (1.3 percent).

            A whole new wave of Obama supporters still don’t even know: They’ll get their first 2013 paychecks on the 15th of the month. So when you’re shooting the breeze in the lunchroom with your grumbling co-workers on the 16th, just ask them, “Who’d you vote for in November?” When they say Mr. Obama, just tell them: “Well, you got what you voted for. You did know he was going to raise taxes, right?”
            The looks on their faces will be priceless.

            Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/jan/6/obama-supporters-shocked-angry-new-tax-increases/?page=2#ixzz2HFkjNA8a

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 7:17 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            HighTechCowboy posted at 5:37 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.
            HTC: Ummm....Have you failed to notice that gas prices have dropped by roughly 50 cents a gallon in the last few months? Have you failed to notice the dramatic drop in natural gas prices?

            IABD- Where do you get your fuel price information?http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/01/04/gasoline-prices-starting-to-rise-again/1810175/

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 7:13 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Health insurance companies in several states are now seeking 20% or greater premium increases, thanks largely to the impact of ObamaCare. In California, Blue Cross is seeking a 27% increase because of the law.

            Way to go, you suckers that reelected Obama. Your royal screwing is about to begin!

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 7:06 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            IABD: Mr. H, Agnostics are like atheists with a type B personality disorder.

            HTC: Yeah, right. That's me -definitely a Type B personalilty.

            IABD: By the way, when did you suddenly side with the EPA's critical theorist's?

            HTC: Where in the world did you get the insane idea that I've sided with the EPA? He//, I'd abolish most of that jack-booted, science-challenged pool of incompetent tyrants. When CO2 was classified as a 'pollutant', the EPA proved that they deserved to go the way of the dinosaurs.


             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 7:03 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            Pete posted at 6:32 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013

            IABD- God certainly did not create all men equal. Unfortunately, he gave you two right thumbs.
            Don't mess with my friend Bronco. His pro bono work has helped you evolve from a snail to a vertebrae at no cost. Someday in a million zillion years you may have the sense of listening but Gawd it will be a long time for you to grow ears.

             
          • Pete posted at 6:32 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            mooseberryinn posted at 1:37 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013

            [thumbup][thumbup]

             
          • Pete posted at 6:29 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            Pete Posts: 3152

            Frank....Really, really well done.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 6:00 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            Mr. H, Agnostics are like atheists with a type B personality disorder. By the way, when did you suddenly side with the EPA's critical theorist's?

             
          • Rob123 posted at 5:51 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            HTC: You were doing so well, then: "Emotion (which has little or no 'evolutionary' advantage)? Negative."....

            THAT"S OUTRAGEOUS! [scared]

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 5:39 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            IABD: http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/2013/01/06/matt-damons-fracking-movie-depicts-gas-companies-as-liars/

            HTC: Damon's fracking movie is a complete fraud. Even the EPA has publicly acknowledged that fact. Do your homework. You're boring me, sonny.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 5:37 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            IABD: Once again, high gas prices are draining our wallets and making us crazy.

            What to do?

            We've drilled, baby, we've drilled. We're now drilling more in this country than we have in nearly a decade.

            HTC: Ummm....Have you failed to notice that gas prices have dropped by roughly 50 cents a gallon in the last few months? Have you failed to notice the dramatic drop in natural gas prices?

            Why? Because of drilling, my friend. Not as much drilling as we could have done if your guy Obama wasn't making drilling on federally-leased lands nearly impossible. All the increase in drilling has been on private lands where that SOB couldn't stop it. Deep horizontal drilling and fracking have made available such abundant supplies of oil and gas that the concept of "peak oil" has become a laughing stock.

            But Obama isn't looking the other way. He's now looking at new ways that he can use the EPA and other regulatory tools to stop this private drilling without ever having to get anything past Congress, something he knows that he has a snowball's chance in he// of doing.

            It's time you quit reading liberal rubbish and did some serious research of your own. The truth is out there for those who want to know it.

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 5:28 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Bronco: Given the advances of science which have dispelled nearly all of the magic and miracles those ignorant flat-earthers couldn't explain, it seems rather desperate to cling to the remaining beliefs.

            HTC: What things has 'science' explained away?

            The origin of life? Negative.

            The origin of the universe? Negative.

            Consciousness? Negative.

            Emotion (which has little or no 'evolutionary' advantage)? Negative.

            Many people make the mistake of believing that science has or can explain everything. The scientific method never makes that claim and scientists know that isn't possible. For example, we have the field of theoretical physics because there are things about our universe that we'll never be able to subject to empirical analysis; therefore, scientific 'proof' will never be possible. So we settle for mathematical 'proof' but just because the numbers pencil out doesn't mean that what they describe actually exists or that things actually work that way in this universe (or any other that we'll never be able to examine.)

            There is a spiritual revival of sorts occuring the field of microbiology. Why? Because we've learned enough about cell structure and cellular processes to realize that even simple single cell life couldn't have created itself. It certainly seemed possible in Darwin's day, when we lacked the tools and knowledge to appreciate the incredible complexity of even simple single-celled organisms.

            Don't get me wrong. These microbiologists aren't rushing out to church to get baptized; however, they realize that we're further away than ever from explaining the origin of life.

            Like them, I'm an agnostic. We can't prove there is a God but we also can't prove that there isn't. The only intellectually honest position is agnosticism. Also like them, I realize that there are many mysteries we can't explain, including the origin of life, so I remain open to the possibility of a "creator." I don't anthropomorphize that 'entitly' or deify it in any way, but I do acknowledge that there are mysteries beyond or understanding and ability to know empirically.

            Bronco: Your theories are so full of holes I don't know where to begin.

            HTC: Speaking of something being "full of holes", are you now ready to abandon the religion of AGW? The myth of AGW has more holes than there are verses in the Bible.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 3:44 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            bBrono- Have you ever played gnostic trivial pursuit?
            check out: http://www.andunie.net/mt-archives/000220.php

             
          • Bronco posted at 3:13 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            gGod's thoughts before creation:

            "What good is being all-knowing when you live in a timeless void? What's to know? And how do I know I'm all-knowing anyway? Does ANYONE know what is all-knowing? If there is something I don't know, how would I know? One doesn't know what one doesn't know, right?...or does one, if one knows all? I would know what I don't know, being all-knowing ...no? And if I can't think of anything that I don't know, does that, by definition, make me all-knowing?...or, does that simply prove that I'm not all-knowing because I don't know what I don't know, ya know? If I really were all-knowing, would I be having these doubts in the first place? Wouldn't I know one way or the other? Or, perhaps, this is merely an epistemological question which with all all-knowing beings must at some time wrestle. Who knows?"

             
          • Bronco posted at 3:01 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            mooseberryinn, you expect me to swallow that? Please. Your theories are so full of holes I don't know where to begin. In your belief system, gGod gave us rationality as a gift, but we are forbidden to use it when it applies to gGod. Sounds like good old Christian Kool Aid to me.

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 2:45 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/2013/01/06/matt-damons-fracking-movie-depicts-gas-companies-as-liars/

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 2:24 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            High Gas Prices: Supply, Demand and the Oil Industry’s Monopoly on Transportation
            Efficiency and Better Cars Will Fuel America Faster than Drilling

            Once again, high gas prices are draining our wallets and making us crazy.

            What to do?

            We've drilled, baby, we've drilled. We're now drilling more in this country than we have in nearly a decade.
            We've given tax breaks and other wasteful incentives to oil companies to try and ease our pain at the pump. We now give about $4 billion in tax breaks to the oil and gas industry each and every year.
            We've listened to naysayers tell us that pursuing clean energy alternatives to oil and gas is a waste of our time and money. Now, the United States is lagging much of the rest of the world on clean energy.
            And what have we gotten in return?

            Gas prices that are hitting new highs, an economy held hostage to global instability and an oil industry monopoly on our transportation system.

            There's nothing we can do to control the price of gas in America, because oil prices are set on a global marketplace. As we've seen, more drilling certainly isn't the answer, because that's done nothing to reduce prices at the pump. The only thing more drilling has done is increase profits for oil companies – to the tune of $137 billion last year alone, a 75 percent rise since the year before. Who else got a 75 percent raise in the middle of a recession?

            The fact is, the only way we can reduce how much we spend on gasoline is to reduce how much gasoline we use.

            We Need More Choice In Transportation

            Our fundamental problem surrounding gas prices is a lack of choice.

            Right now, with few exceptions, we must all fill our cars with gasoline. If we don't like it, too bad.

            Right now the average U.S. household buys more than 1,100 gallons of gas per year. At $4 per gallon, that means the average household spends $4,400 per year just on gasoline

            More efficient vehicles could help dramatically. Hybrid vehicles can cost about half as much to operate as conventional vehicles. New fuel economy standards that take effect this year can deliver thousands of dollars in gas savings to Americans who can afford new cars. By 2025, the new 54.5 miles per gallon fuel standard will save consumers $4,400 over the lifetime of their vehicle. By 2030, the United States could save $200 billion as a result of the new standards.

            New choices for fuel can help too. Electric vehicles now on the market, for example, can cost the equivalent of $1 per gallon at today’s average electricity prices.

            Americans who have the choice of walking, biking, taking public transportation, or telecommuting to work can skip trips to the gas pump altogether. According to a new report, switching to public transportation would save the average driver a whopping $10,120 a year.

            Here's the problem though: Not all Americans have these choices. Many of us have no other choice than to drive to work, and pay out the nose for gasoline to do it.

            We Need Policies That Give Americans More Transportation Choices

            Instead of continuing to give tax breaks to oil companies, why not channel that money to consumers to help buy more efficient vehicles or to fund research to build even better vehicles?

            Instead of cutting public transit funding, why not invest in mass transit to make it more accessible to more Americans?

            Instead of keeping ourselves captive to a single fuel choice -- oil -- why not help give Americans more choices, with policies that support vehicles that run on electricity or cellulosic biofuels that don't deplete food stocks or degrade the environment.

            Instead of eliminate programs that encourage biking, walking and sustainable real estate development, why not do more to foster these gas-saving alternatives?

            http://www.nrdc.org/energy/gasprices/?gclid=CJ6M8uHT1LQCFS-RPAodZwsAbA

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 1:44 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Another Obama business 'success' story:

            Delaware taxpayers appear to be getting soaked twice under a deal in which the Democratic governor loaned $21.5 million to a hybrid electric carmaker to set up shop in the state. The company has yet to produce a car in Delaware, and taxpayers are footing the electric bill for the idle plant.

            The deal was enthusiastically announced in 2009 by Gov. Jack Markell and Vice President Biden -- formerly Delaware's senior senator -- as a way to bring as many as 2,500 green jobs to the state. But California-based Fisker Automotive Inc. has since suffered a series of setbacks that have compounded its shaky financial situation.

            "It has not worked out the way he had envisioned," Markell spokeswoman Cathy Rossi acknowledged Monday in a statement to FoxNews.com. "We didn't know and couldn't have known about the underlying technical and financial problems."

            Delaware reportedly has paid at least $400,000 in utility bills since about April, when Fisker halted operations and laid off dozens of workers at the 142-acre, Wilmington-area facility. Markell staffers told The News Journal the payments are part of the grant deal and necessary to at least keep Fisker's small-scale operation on life support.

            Fisker opened for business in 2007, and its early problems were largely related to such technical issues as steering and emissions.

            However, in February the U.S. Energy Department stopped disbursements on Fisker's $529 million loan because the company purportedly failed to meet production and sales goals on its electric plug-in sedan, the Karma.

            The lack of funds was followed by the company halting operations at the Delaware facility, a formerly abandoned General Motors plant.

            Later that year, Fisker battery supplier A123 Systems filed for bankruptcy and the company lost a reported $30 million worth of cars when Hurricane Sandy floodwaters swamped a port in Newark, N.J.

            In a sign of Fisker's problems, Chief Executive Officer Tony Posawatz said in late November that the company was looking for a financial partner.

            Fisker has not returned a request for comment, but has publicly said it is not seeking a buyer and still intends to re-open in Delaware.

            The $21.5 million from Delaware is composed of a $9 million grant and a $12.5 million loan that includes so-called "claw backs" should Fisker fail to meet deadlines. However, recovering that money should the company fold will not be easy. The Energy Department purportedly pushed for provisions in the Delaware deal that puts the state behind the federal government, which is owed roughly $193 million in disbursements, and the Silicon Valley Bank in California that also is purportedly owed millions.

            "This is never a good roll for the government -- corporate welfare," said Paul Chesser, an associate fellow at the conservative-leaning National Legal and Policy Center. "Let the market put up the money, not the taxpayer."

            Chesser also points out the similarities of California-based solar company Solyndra going bankrupt after receiving nearly $530 million in federal loan money from the Obama administration.

            "There's a trend of companies with no track record -- or in this case failure -- being worthy of government investment," he said.

            As for the utility bills, staffers with the Delaware government have not responded to several attempts to verify whether the payments are still being made, but have said the administration's actions were an earnest attempt to recoup thousands of lost auto industry jobs in the state.

            "Gov. Markell has said this is the best shot," Rossi said.

            John C. Sigler, chairman of the Republican State Committee of Delaware, said he never liked the deal and even more so upon learning the state "stands third in line to get back its money."

            "The taxpayers will take a bath," he said. "Never gamble with taxpayers' money. It belongs to them, not the government."

            http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/01/05/delaware-taxpayers-increasingly-on-hook-as-fisker-auto-plant-idles/

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 1:40 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            Good Gal shoots Bad Guy:

            http://www.ajc.com/news/news/local/mother-of-two-surprises-burglar-with-five-gunshots/nTnGR/

            But Dianne Feinstein prefers defenseless moms and victimized kids.

             
          • mooseberryinn posted at 1:37 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            mooseberryinn Posts: 2697

            Oh, p.s. - bronco - you have all the necessary tools to educate yourself as to history, religions, writings and teachings etc. Faith however, comes as a gift. Sadly, you may miss out on that gift, as your seem to suffer a condition that leads you to believe you and certain others know all there is to know. Well, you don't, and most likely never will. sorry.

             
          • Bronco posted at 1:31 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            A female CNN journalist heard about a very elderly Jewish man who had been going to the Western Wall, twice a day, every day, for a long, long time. So she went to check it out and there he was, walking very slowly up to the holy site.
            She watched him pray for about 45 minutes, then he walked away, very slowly, using his cane.
            "Pardon me sir. I'm Rebecca Smith from CNN. What's your name?"
            "Morris Feinberg," he replied.
            "Sir, how long have you been coming to the Western wall and praying?"
            "About 60 years," he said.
            "60 years! That's amazing! What do you pray for?"
            "I pray for peace between the Christians and Jews and Muslims. I pray for all the wars and hatred to stop. I pray for all our children to grow up safely as responsible adults and to love their fellow man. I pray that all politicians tell us the truth and put the interests of the people ahead of their own interests."
            The journalist then asked, "How do you feel after doing this for 60 years?"
            The old man replied, "Like I'm talking to a f****ing wall."

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 1:29 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/01/06/1176714/-Far-Right-Wing-Preppers-planning-a-walled-town-on-a-N-Idaho-Mountaintop

             
          • mooseberryinn posted at 1:27 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            mooseberryinn Posts: 2697

            Bronco, old buddy, old pal, ya don't know yer butt from yer head. Ya see, the opposite of Good is not evil. The opposite of Good is Chaos. Now then, God created the whole shootin' match and then the laws that govern nature. Stuff like physics, chemistry, instincts of animals, growth of plants etc. etc. One of those little details is that Humankind has free will. This is where stuff gets all screwed up. Oh, before we get into that., science has NOT dispelled anything about religion, or faith, but the science types have said they're not sure. So anyway, allegedly, the earth has everything humankind needs to survive, the suffering comes in because humankind hasn't done a real great job in taking care of itself. Simple as that. Ya know, some folks would say because you don't believe, "burn him". But, because some folks believe in God's teachings, (via the Bible), they'll let ya get by being a dufus. You should be glad for yer good fortune. Oh, that reminds me, the "laws of random chance" were God's idea too.

             
          • Bronco posted at 1:05 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            Frank, convenient that you omitted 'all good' when you mentioned 'all knowing' and 'all powerful' in your description of gGod. Had you not done that, your 'Evil Exists' Two Cents a couple of weeks ago would be a sign of a weak rationale.

            An ALL good, All powerful gGod could not, for any reason or excuse, allow evil to exist.

            As far as being omniscient, how do you get around that? I mean, 'knowing' all the suffering people endured/endure/will endure, yet going ahead with the Divine Plan? Sounds to me like a god without a trace of empathy or compassion. Closing one's eyes and stupidly accepting gGod's existence on blind faith or based on stories passed down during the Bronze Age by illiterate desert-dwellers seems pathetic when one is actual capable of critical thinking. Given the advances of science which have dispelled nearly all of the magic and miracles those ignorant flat-earthers couldn't explain, it seems rather desperate to cling to the remaining beliefs.

            gGod may exist, but is he willing to trade? Worship for good fortune? Adoration and belief in him in exchange for his interference to make the world a better place? That god seems rather petulant: Allow Me back in schools or I will stand by while children are killed.

            No. How about we take personal responsibility seriously for a change?

             
          • Bronco posted at 12:02 pm on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            Bronco Posts: 4328

            Where to begin...?

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qzf8q9QHfhI

             
          • Rob123 posted at 11:46 am on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            laker1 posted at 11:15 am on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            [smile] [cool]

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 11:38 am on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            kohana posted at 10:24 am on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            kohana- "The article is written by a Rabbi, who should know his Bible and Israeli history fairly well."

            IABD- kohana- I beg your pardon and excuse my ignorance but has anyone else ever listened to a Jewish Rabbi who was for Christ's sake or Mohammad's? I am sure the Israeli holyland tourism industry may agree with you however.

             
          • laker1 posted at 11:15 am on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            laker1 Posts: 112

            Rob123

            I was thinking of “Das is nicht einmal falsch” or “Je n'ai pas besoin de cette hypothese” but Nestorian Christianity . . . cool for cats, man.

             
          • kohana posted at 10:24 am on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            I also do not agree with all articles from the American Thinker, however, Frank's 2 cents worth this morning is on "God in Charge" rather than anyone else. The article is written by a Rabbi, who should know his Bible and Israeli history fairly well. If IABD's only critic of the article is the source, not the content then it is not valid.

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Thinker

            American Thinker
            From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

            American Thinker is a daily conservative online magazine dealing with American politics, foreign policy, national security, Israel, economics, diplomacy, culture and military strategy. American Thinker has been mentioned in other media including Le Monde, The Guardian, Inter Press Service, Campus Watch, and the New York Times.

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Markos_Moulitsas founder, editor and publisher of Dailykos, an ex-Republican, first hand witness of a communist dictatorship in El Salvador, but still backs Obama. The Dailykos, by it's own admission is a Democratic rag, written for and by progressive Democrats.

             
          • lousia posted at 10:16 am on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            lousia Posts: 196

            Thanks Frank for the very en-lighting 2 cent column it was a pleasure to read, In this messed and mixed up world . anyway one thing where all the so called atheist are trying in telling us how to live, and you must take that down ,I am one person but i can't look at it, even if i have only seen it once in my life, all they want is attention and the news media usually is their best attention getter. and most everyone bows down and complies with their dumb wishes.well for my self, my opinion, if any one else doesn't thats their problem, I believe in the God very much so, and Its a beautiful day, suppose to snow. Thanks

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 10:10 am on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            HighTechCowboy posted at 9:59 am on Sun, Jan 6, 2013

            Still letting letting the 'red-diaper babies' do your 'thinking' for you?
            http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/David_Horowitz

             
          • HighTechCowboy posted at 9:59 am on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            HighTechCowboy Posts: 9902

            It's a beautiful day posted at 9:44 am on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            Still letting other progressive nutjobs do your 'thinking' (or is that 'stinking') for you, I see.

            That's a characteristic that your kind almost universally share; that is, you write off alternative points of view based on other idiots' panning of them without EVER doing any serious reading and research of their content for yourself.

            While I don't always agree with everything posted at American Thinker (who does agree with everything at any site?), most of their material is well thought out, carefully researched and fact-based. That's far more than can be said for sites such MoveOn and DailyKos, whose swill you swallow in large gulps without ever questioning it.

            Your are such the stereotypical progressive that it really cracks me up everytime I recall your mentioning that you were voted "most conservative" at Flathead High School. Take a BIG hit to the head since then?

             
          • It's a beautiful day posted at 9:44 am on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            It's a beautiful day Posts: 1832

            kohana posted at 8:13 am on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.
            kohana-"Another bit of history from the Bible, when gGod is in charge." by Asher Gladson in American Thinker article January 6, 2013

            IABD- check the source of your post:
            http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/American_Thinker

             
          • mooseberryinn posted at 8:48 am on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            mooseberryinn Posts: 2697

            Frank, nicely done. As usual, standby for flak.

             
          • kohana posted at 8:13 am on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            kohana Posts: 2109

            Another bit of history from the Bible, when gGod is in charge.

            January 6, 2013
            Seven Years
            Asher Gladson

            Seven years ago on January 4 by the Gregorian calendar, Ariel Sharon was felled by a stroke that has left him alive but incommunicative. Daily I have prayed the Jewish prayer for healing, the Shel'mah, for his recovery; for I hoped that his stroke was similar to what happened to Nebuchadnezzar in Daniel 4:24-37.

            Sharon's stroke occurred after he forced all the Jews who lived in and prospered in Gaza, for the first time in its history, to evacuate. Most of those Jews are still without permanent and proper homes and must continue to pay their mortgages on their homes in Gaza that the Palestinians have destroyed. Where is the justice here? Jewish businessmen around the world bought the greenhouses and gave them to the Palestinians who then destroyed most of them, but no one has had mercy on the evicted Jews!

            Considering his lifetime of dedication to the state of Israel, I believed that Sharon had taken this dramatic and egregious step in order to graphically prove to the world that the Palestinians had no ability or intention of running a proper state, but would instead devote all their energy and monies to the destruction of Israel and the murder of the Jewish people. I believed that as soon as it became obvious to the world that even having total control of Gaza was not sufficient incentive for the Palestinians to form a proper nation, that he would take the IDF back into Gaza and evacuate the Arabs.

            None of my positive hopes have materialized. Hamas and Fatah have confirmed they are incapable of responsible rule and have no intention of living in peace side by side with the Jews.

            Where is the Israeli press? Why is no one pointing out these facts on the ground so lessons can be learned about Gaza for Judea and Samaria?

            Why would Israel's God keep Sharon in a vegetative state for seven years if his suffering and the suffering of his family were not for a supremely important reason?

            What might God's reason be? An object lesson to the Prime Minister and all the "princes" of Israel: Do not surrender land that I promised you for perpetuity and that I have returned to you.

            If I did this to Ariel Sharon over Gaza, a hell-hole for most of its history and where I never once met with your ancestors, what do you think I will do if you give up parts of Judea and Samaria or surrender all of it to my enemies? I covenanted with you in the land of Ephraim on the mountains of Israel. How dare you even consider flouting my promises and treating my gift of victory in war with contempt! Look at Ariel Sharon and learn.

            Daniel 4:29(32)-34(37): "The kingdom has left you. . . as seven seasons pass over you, until you learn that the Most high rules in the human kingdom and gives it to whomever he pleases. . . When this period was over, I, Nebuchadnezzar, lifted my eyes toward heaven, and my understanding came back to me. I blessed the Most High. . . He does what he wishes with the army of heaven and with those living on earth. . . now I, Nebuchadnezzar, praise, exalt and honor the King of heaven: "For all his works are truth, and his ways are just; and he can humble those who walk in pride.'" Amen.

            Has anyone learned anything from the Sharon family calamity?

            Page Printed from: http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2013/01/seven_years.html at January 06, 2013

             
          • Rob123 posted at 2:56 am on Sun, Jan 6, 2013.

            Rob123 Posts: 6607

            "So, if I have to put my faith in a power greater than myself — whose majesty is mysterious and whose ways are often unfathomable — I’m willing to do that."

            As you approach this Nestorian Christianity, I assume your Pastor will raise an eyebrow and you will mention the pertinent Amendments plus the Bill of Rights and all will smile and maybe hug each other and continue walking through the Supermarket, pointing out the various base ingredients that tie all the major religions together? Cool! No need for big armies to crush the heretics here! Just an appreciation of the Little Boat or the Big Boat, depending upon ones comfort level?

            Of course, like Odysseus, there are many distractions in one's travels. I would think your main distraction, from previous 2 cents, would be that cheerleader Ayn Rand and her love of Will and Materialism? Good luck with that! She does, however, help one navigate the Corporate America that we have become, especially those who climb the Ladder after poking out the eye of the Cyclops?

            Of course, it's a big supermarket, so feel free to choose your meme.